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Adaptec - FreeBSD

Since the original Adaptec guy Doug has blocked his mail, here is the email address of the next person at Adaptec who is involved in this. He has also previously indicated that he would be involved in any decision to provide doentation on the aac RAID management interface. Marty Turner com Product Manager Adaptec, Inc. (919) 287-2045 Sorry Marty, but you are only getting comments from your customers....

  1. #1

    Default Adaptec

    Since the original Adaptec guy Doug has blocked his mail, here is the
    email address of the next person at Adaptec who is involved in this.

    He has also previously indicated that he would be involved in any
    decision to provide doentation on the aac RAID management
    interface.

    Marty Turner
    com
    Product Manager
    Adaptec, Inc.
    (919) 287-2045

    Sorry Marty, but you are only getting comments from your customers.
    Theo Guest

  2. #2

    Default Re: Adaptec

    I'm sorry, but aside from the chain of emails subject'd Adaptec AAC
    raid support, what good does this email serve to the
    freebsd-questions mailing lists? The only thing this is doing is
    perpetuating the cycle of emails which is simply clogging inboxes.
    While some of the discussion may be constructive or useful in the
    other thread, this is not.

    Try and keep your subjects together so I can archive them more easily
    and not be forced to read over more. If anything, this sort of email
    belongs entirely on your misc lists, not the freebsd lists.

    -Tomas Quintero
    FreeBSD User


    On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 15:10:29 -0700, Theo de Raadt
    <openbsd.org> wrote: 
    Tomas Guest

  3. #3

    Default Re: Adaptec

    Well, Tomas,

    The issue is that not all FreeBSD users accept a dependency on
    binary-only non-free components.

    Some of them do care.

    Perhaps not you, but some of them do.
     

    No, Tomas, you are incorrect.

    Yes, thousands of mails are being sent to Adaptec right now, but
    these mails are coming from their CUSTOMERS.

    Now if I was a company and I was doing something that ed off
    my customers, I would like to know, that's for sure.

    So your use of the word "clogging" is incorrect.
     

    No, Tomas, it is entirely useful.

    It is due to activism actions like this that the doentation for
    many many chipsets was freed up, for years now, chipsets which I am
    sure YOU are using on your machine RIGHT NOW. I have been at this
    for 10 years now, and I am sure you have not. It has been a momentous
    struggle, and it is not over yet.
     

    It belongs whereveer there are people who care about being able to
    have drivers for their hardware.


    Otherwise what you are asking for is simply ... that the developer's
    hands be tied.

    Flat out, you are wrong. This affects everyone.


     [/ref]
    Theo Guest

  4. #4

    Default Re: Adaptec

    There is no problem with giving FreeBSD users who really do want free
    software, and freedom of choice, the contact information for who to
    talk to at Adaptec. Everyone in the Free Software industry should be
    telling all hardware companies what they think about their ways of
    doing business, whether it's good or bad.

    Jason


    On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 17:22:16 -0500, Tomas Quintero <com> wrote: 
    >
    >[/ref]
    Jason Guest

  5. #5

    Default Re: Adaptec

    Mr. Turner,
    I am very disappointed that Doug is no longer accepting emails
    from Adaptec customers. I hope it is not Adaptec policy to just
    disregard all customers when they start telling you how they feel
    about your hardware and business practices. Previous talks with an
    ex-employee from Adaptec has led me to believe that Adaptec does
    indeed just disregard their customers, because he stated that "Why do
    you think Adaptec should care about an OS that only has a small...".
    To get the full quote, just ask Doug, as I forwarded that message to
    him along with my reply. It seems that this is probably a running
    theme with Adaptec employees to just disregard customers, but Theo has
    counted over 1,800 AAC-style raid controllers in the OpenBSD community
    alone, and many other communities would benefit as well. If Adaptec
    doesn't care about a community that can account for thousands of
    Adaptec products, not just raid controllers, then you are sending the
    message that your customers should not care about Adaptec anymore, and
    take their business elsewhere. If that's what Adaptec wants, keep up
    your current communication, or lack there of. Adaptec will be losing
    many, many customers if this is not remedied.

    Jason Crawford
    Jason Guest

  6. #6

    Default Re: Adaptec

    hi tomas,

    On Sun, Mar 20, 2005 at 05:22:16PM -0500, Tomas Quintero wrote: 

    it's the main interest of many many many users to have open source
    drivers for their hardware! i'm working on a free driver for atheros
    wireless chipsets since a long time and i get an amazing feedback from
    quite a lot people.

    i started this project for the first generation of atheros' chipsets
    before there was any madwifi or ath binary-blob. atheros was not very
    happy about my work but the users - the open source community -
    encouraged me to continue my efforts. i implemented it for openbsd but
    i also continuously get massive feedback from freebsd, netbsd and
    linux people who are upset about their partially non-free and
    binary-only options.

    of course, my driver does not support all the proprietary and bleeding
    edge features, like the binary-blob does, but everything for basic
    operation is mostly done. it's the choice of the freebsd _users_ if
    they want to lose their freedom to get some "features" (and pleased
    manufacturers) or if they want to have free software with all of it's
    benefits.
     

    from the FreeBSD website:
    ---snip---
    FreeBSD is free

    While you might expect an operating system with these features to sell
    for a high price, FreeBSD is available free of charge and comes with
    full source code. If you would like to purchase or download a copy to
    try out, more information is available.
    ---snap---

    the users should ask the developers - where is the full source code?

    so it's absolutely correct from theo to cc the freebsd-questions
    mailing list because it's a _main_question_! we care about freebsd,
    netbsd and even linux because this behaviour hurts the entire open
    source community. more and more manufacturers are having success with
    getting their binary-blobs into "free" operating systems. what next?

    it's like accepting software patents or ridiculous copyright acts, but
    nobody benefits from it in a long term. some huge companies may have
    some initial business advantages if they protect their "intellectual
    property", cover everything with patents and close their hard- and
    software. but it does have a immense drawback, it will stop a
    society's technical and economical progress and the users are free to
    buy open and well-supported hardware from companies like ralinktech or
    lsi.

    and btw., it has always been a great benefit to _all_ of the free
    operating systems to share good code and to improve it in an ongoing
    development. free software development is like evolution and not like
    genetically enhanced glowing fishes which are unable to reproduce. i
    have some friends who are addicted to freebsd and i'm addicted to
    openbsd, but we're all certain about the need for 100% free software.

    reyk
    reyk@vantronix.net Guest

  7. #7

    Default RE: Adaptec

    org wrote: 

    One of these days atheros will decide it's time to obsolete all those
    devices out there so as to attempt to get people to buy new ones. When
    that happens, the binary-blob won't work anymore. When that happens your
    driver will be the only option.
     

    Such a scenario is simply not viable over the long term. The
    manufacturer
    always has to pay to write new blobs for new OS versions. Once the
    manufacturer decides to stop spending money writing new blobs, a
    decision that is inevitable, the blobs won't work any longer and the
    blob will go away.

    Ted

    Ted Guest

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