coming out of the shadows... where's the black channel?

[dave milbut]

Using ps7.01 (and I think this happens in 6).

From an old adobe tutorial that I saved from the bit bucket, and saved at:

<http://aikodude.tripod.com/PSRemoveShadows/main.html>

Step 3 says:

Step 3: Bring the original color image window to the top by clicking in
it, then choose Select > Load Selection, and use the grayscale copy as
your selection. Set the background channel to Black, check the Invert
box, and click OK. After loading the selection, you should see a dotted
line around the shadow areas.




There isn't any black channel in the grayscale image, just gray.

Now I know that this tut. is real old. I'm guessing it came out around PS version 5 or 5.5. Can anyone tell me if this feature/option - the black channel in a grayscale image - has gone away? This problem has been side-discussed a couple of times in various threads by some of us regulars and other users, but we haven't been able to come up with a solution. Loading the gray channel, the only one available, isn't bad - sometimes, but no where near as good as the effect the old technique provided.

'tis a shame because this is a killer technique for brightening up dark images.

I was hoping Chris or Mark or ANYone can help me out here. If the black channel ISN'T available any longer, can you see another way to achive the same effect? If it is available, maybe the way to get at it has changed? Can you provide some direction please?

mucho gracias por adelantado,

thanks in advance,

dave

[JasonSmith]

It said to duplicate the image, then convert to greyscale...maybe they mean the black channel of the original file - before it was converted?

[Thomas Madsen]

dave milbut wrote:

> the black channel ISN'T available any longer, can you see another
> way to achive the same effect?

What if you convert the dublicate to CMYK instead of grayscale?
On the CMYK duplicate you can make a new document (right click on
the black channel and choose Duplicate Channel > Destination: New).
Then give the new document with the black channel some Gaussian
blur and use that document to load the selection in the original
image?

I haven't tried it much but theoretically I guess it would work(?).

--
Regards
Madsen.

[barry gray]

An easier way to accomplish the same thing-
Dup. highest contrast channel-usually the green
Invert-paint out the parts you dont want affected with black
Blur
load selection
return to RGB
fill with 50% gray set to color dodge
or fill with gray on new layer set to dodge-adjust opacity and maybe darken or lighten

[dave milbut]

jason, nope. the original has always been rgb. no black there. the black USED to show in grayscale. i'm pretty sure of it. i even actionized it and saved it that way... now when i run the action, there's no black channel and it selects the gray instead. strange.

tom, also strange, can't seem to get the load selection menu option to be active when only an rgb and a cmyk image is open (ie it's grayed out, unselectable)

barry, that's pretty close, but i'm not sure it's the same. thanks, i'll be using that if i can't find out what happened to that dratted black channel in grayscale! :)

chris, if you see this can you point me to what's up? is this a lost cause?

[dave milbut]

btw, you can see the action with the set black channel of grayscale document step saved here:

<http://aikodude.tripod.com/RS.html>

'bout 1/2 way down the page. under the link called "Remove Shadows Action". I'd link it directly but it's a free tripod site and they don't allow direct linking except off their hosted pages.

if you try to run the action step by step (double click each step) in v7, it CHANGES it from "black channel" to "current channel" in the action. (current being gray, the only channel in a grayscale document.)

odd.

thanks for all the advice so far,

dave

[Thomas Madsen]

dave milbut wrote:

> tom, also strange, can't seem to get the load selection menu
> option to be active when only an rgb and a cmyk image is open (ie
> it's grayed out, unselectable)

Don't load the selection from the CMYK image. Load the selection
from the new document made from the black channel in the CMYK
duplicate. :)

--
Regards
Madsen.

[Trevor Noble]

dave milbut wrote:

> Using ps7.01 (and I think this happens in 6).
>
> From an old adobe tutorial that I saved from the bit bucket, and
> saved at:
>
> <http://aikodude.tripod.com/PSRemoveShadows/main.html>
>
> Step 3 says:
>
> Step 3: Bring the original color image window to the top by
> clicking in it, then choose Select > Load Selection, and use
> the grayscale copy as your selection. Set the background
> channel to Black, check the Invert box, and click OK. After
> loading the selection, you should see a dotted line around the
> shadow areas.
>
>
>
>
> There isn't any black channel in the grayscale image, just gray.
>
> Now I know that this tut. is real old. I'm guessing it came out
> around PS version 5 or 5.5. Can anyone tell me if this feature/option
> - the black channel in a grayscale image - has gone away? This
> problem has been side-discussed a couple of times in various threads
> by some of us regulars and other users, but we haven't been able to
> come up with a solution. Loading the gray channel, the only one
> available, isn't bad - sometimes, but no where near as good as the
> effect the old technique provided.
>
> 'tis a shame because this is a killer technique for brightening up
> dark images.
>
> I was hoping Chris or Mark or ANYone can help me out here. If the
> black channel ISN'T available any longer, can you see another way to
> achive the same effect? If it is available, maybe the way to get at
> it has changed? Can you provide some direction please?
>
> mucho gracias por adelantado,
>
> thanks in advance,
>
> dave

A general way of allowing a little extra detail into high density shadows
without affecting the overall image is:
1. Dupe image layer
2. Invert it
3. Desaturate it
4. Set blend mode to Soft Light
5. Add gaussian blur and adjust the amount for the effect you need (roughly
set it to blur all detail from the new layer).

This should help all digital camera users ;-)
Regds
Trevor

[dave milbut]

hmm... i'll have to try this tomorrow after work. how do you get the selection once you duplicate. just crtl-click? can you go into a bit more detail please?

thanks, dave

[Thomas]

dave,

Try this:
<http://home18.inet.tele.dk/madsen/photoshop/out_of_the_shadows.pdf>
(1,97 MB).

--
Regards
Madsen.

[dave]

chris, can you comment on the black channel missing? is it truly gone now?

thanks, dave

[Phosphor]

Dave...

I just worked through that tutorial again, word-for-word, for the first time since I originally encountered it all those years ago. It confirmed what I thought was tripping you up.

What I think is going on here is that "Black" was simply renamed to the more correct "Gray". The only channel available in a Grayscale document IS Gray, and the name reflects the fact that the channel is indeed shades of gray, and not the erroneously-named "Black" which might imply a 1-bit color depth, as in a Bitmap image. Just follow along, and where you used to see "Black" use the "Gray" channel that is available. Same thing, more appropriate name.

No need, really, to create the duplicate Grayscale image; You'll get the same results by loading the luminosity of the composite color image (CTRL + Alt +Shift + ~), then feathering the resulting selection (use the same radius value that you'd enter for Gaussian Blur in the original tutorial.) Proceed from there with filling with 50% gray in Color Dodge mode.

[dave]

That's about what I was thinking phos, I was just looking for some confirmation. thanks.

chris, still like to hear from you to be certain. thanks again!

dave

[Norbert]

Looks like Chris is on vacation. Meaning the Inyection molders are turning out PS8 disks one every 3.8 seconds.
Yes a modern plastic inyection molding machine has that capacity.