Copying B/W Negatives

[Marvin Rosen]

I want to make 1:1 copies of 35mm negatives. using a slide copier
that is coupled to the camera. Which b/w film & developer do
you recommend? Is it possible to use 35mm color print or slide
film to make copies? Maximum size prints desired will be 4x5.

[Nicholas O. Lindan]

"Marvin Rosen" <puns@att.net> wrote

> I want to make 1:1 copies of 35mm negatives.

Do you want to make slides from the negatives or do you want to
make negatives from the negatives?

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio [email]nolindan@ix.netcom.com[/email]
Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.

[Marvin Rosen]

I should have been more explicit!
I want to make negatives from negatives
"Marvin Rosen" <puns@att.net> wrote in message
news:eCRQa.55398$0v4.3784757@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...

> I want to make 1:1 copies of 35mm negatives. using a slide copier
> that is coupled to the camera. Which b/w film & developer do
> you recommend? Is it possible to use 35mm color print or slide
> film to make copies? Maximum size prints desired will be 4x5.
>
>

[John Miller]

Marvin Rosen wrote:

> I should have been more explicit!
> I want to make negatives from negatives

Then you'll want either to have B&W film processed for reversal (don't know
where to point you for that if you don't have your own darkroom) or use
color slide film.

--
John Miller

For men use, if they have an evil turn, to write it in marble:
and whoso doth us a good turn we write it in dust.
-Sir Thomas More

[Nicholas O. Lindan]

"Marvin Rosen" <puns@att.net> wrote

> I want to make [B&W] negatives from [B&W] negatives

The shortest route is to use a slide film.
Three choices are:

Kodak Edupe Ektachrome - made especially for use in slide
duplicators, low contrast emulsion. The resulting
negatives will have some color to them, but this shouldn't
cause any problem when printing.

Agfa Scala black & white slide film - a standard B&W slide
film, you may have trouble controlling contrast

T-Max 100 & reversal kit - reversal chemistry is available
from Photographers' Formulary, contrast control may be
an issue, you will need your own darkroom

If I was doing this I would try the Edupe first.


--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio [email]nolindan@ix.netcom.com[/email]
Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.

[Nicholas O. Lindan]

Marvin wrote:

> From the standpoint of simplicity I am looking into
> the "Kodak edupe ektachrome" Do you think i will
> need any filters if all i'm interested in is duplicates of
> b/w negatives? Also i could not find the ISO of this
> film.

Go to [url]http://www.kodak.com[/url] and search for Tech Pub E-2529

Kodak is very coy about the EI. They recommend you look for
it somewhere in the range 4 - 40. I guess they want you
to have to buy two rolls: one to find the EI and the other
one to make the dupes.

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio [email]nolindan@ix.netcom.com[/email]
Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.

[Michael Scarpitti]

"Marvin Rosen" <puns@att.net> wrote in message news:<9FSQa.55442$0v4.3788674@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...

> I should have been more explicit!
> I want to make negatives from negatives
> "Marvin Rosen" <puns@att.net> wrote in message
> news:eCRQa.55398$0v4.3784757@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...

> > I want to make 1:1 copies of 35mm negatives. using a slide copier
> > that is coupled to the camera. Which b/w film & developer do
> > you recommend? Is it possible to use 35mm color print or slide
> > film to make copies? Maximum size prints desired will be 4x5.
> >
> >

To be quite blunt, this makes no sense for most purposes, as a
duplicate negative will never be as sharp as the original. Kodak make
some B&W duplicating films for this purpose, and these are darkroom
films that you expose and develop like paper. The films are 'printed'
by contact with the original negative, as optical would be inferior.

[url]http://www.kodak.com/global/en/business/docimaging/globalPages/tabbedContent.jhtml?id=3100020&show=3100131[/url]

[Michael Scarpitti]

"Marvin Rosen" <puns@att.net> wrote in message news:<eCRQa.55398$0v4.3784757@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...

> I want to make 1:1 copies of 35mm negatives. using a slide copier
> that is coupled to the camera. Which b/w film & developer do
> you recommend? Is it possible to use 35mm color print or slide
> film to make copies? Maximum size prints desired will be 4x5.

Do you understand this will give you TERRIBLE negatives?

Those slide copiers are horrible optically.

[Peter Irwin]

In rec.photo.darkroom Nicholas O. Lindan <nolindan@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>
> Peter <pirwin@ktb.net> wrote

>> You might want to try Eastman 5360 Direct MP film. It is a very slow
>> (around EI 0.3) copy film which forms direct positives (or in your
>> case direct negative copies) with normal black and white developer.

>
> The directions for it imply contacting in a machine for making dupes
> of B&W movies - which I sort of discounted most folks having access
> to, and so I passed it by.
>
> But, yes, there is nothing to preclude cutting the stuff up in 6-exposure
> strips and contacting it to the original negative strips. 5360 is ortho,
> so you can use it with a red safelight, making the job easier.

I had a go at dupliciating negatives tonight with 5360 in a Leitz
Eldia contact printer. I think that 7 minutes in D76 1:1 is about
right. My original estimate wasn't near enough. It also requires
exposures several times those of fast enlarging papers or 5302
Fine grain Release Positive.

I won't know for sure until I print them, but I think that the
duplicates are of decent quality. They certainly look sharp
with a 10x loupe.

> This may be the best solution. Chuck the slide duplicator.

You could use 5360 in a good setup with a proper macro
lens and it would make dust much easier to control.
The Eldia contact printer does a wonderful job, but I find
it very difficult to get all surfaces dust free.

>On the emulsion side, [url]http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/products/lab/5234.shtml[/url],
> appears to be Kodak's recommendation for the highest quality reproduction.
> It is a negative/positive process, but you would end up with a set
> of B&W slides as the 'internegative'.
>

Let me know if you can get 5234 neg and 5366 master positive film
in short lengths. I think the smallest unit Kodak sells them in is
1000 feet. They are pretty cheap by the foot, but it does seem
like a lot to have in my fridge.

Peter.
---
[email]pirwin@ktb.net[/email]

[Peter Chant]

In article <bf50op$gkv$1@dns.ktb.net>,
Peter Irwin <pirwin@ktb.net> writes:

>
> I had a go at dupliciating negatives tonight with 5360 in a Leitz
> Eldia contact printer. I think that 7 minutes in D76 1:1 is about
> right. My original estimate wasn't near enough. It also requires
> exposures several times those of fast enlarging papers or 5302
> Fine grain Release Positive.
>

I wonder - would it be possible to make B&W slides from B&W negs by
contact. Assuming contrast would be low I'd assume that one would need
to push the film a lot to boost it. Would the result be too grainy?

--
[email]pete@petezilla.co.uk[/email]
[url]http://www.petezilla.co.uk[/url]

[Tony Parkinson]

"Peter Chant" <pete@petezilla.co.uk> wrote ...

>>

> I wonder - would it be possible to make B&W slides from B&W negs by
> contact. Assuming contrast would be low I'd assume that one would need
> to push the film a lot to boost it. Would the result be too grainy?
>

Well, one thing is for certain, it would give better results than trying to
produce B&W slides by cross-processing some of the chromogenic C-41 B&W
films in E-6 chemistry. Unless, of course, you like a nasty green cast on
your B&W Slides

[Peter Irwin]

In rec.photo.darkroom Peter Chant <pete@petezilla.co.uk> wrote:

> In article <bf50op$gkv$1@dns.ktb.net>,
> Peter Irwin <pirwin@ktb.net> writes:

>>
>> I had a go at dupliciating negatives tonight with 5360 in a Leitz
>> Eldia contact printer. I think that 7 minutes in D76 1:1 is about
>> right. My original estimate wasn't near enough. It also requires
>> exposures several times those of fast enlarging papers or 5302
>> Fine grain Release Positive.
>>

>
> I wonder - would it be possible to make B&W slides from B&W negs by
> contact. Assuming contrast would be low I'd assume that one would need
> to push the film a lot to boost it. Would the result be too grainy?
>

You can use Eastman 5302 Fine Grain Release Positive film
to print slides from negatives. It is movie print film,
which has an emulsion similar to enlargement papers.
You can use the same safelight that you use with paper.

Developement in straight Dektol for 4 minutes give good results
for many negatives. You can vary the contrast by choice of
developer. D-76 gives softer results, I understand that D-19
gives harder results, but I haven't tried it.

The film is very fine grained, even when developed in Dektol.

Peter.
---
[email]pirwin@ktb.net[/email]