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Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine? - Macromedia Director 3D

[q] Originally posted by: Macromartin I'd be more anxious about the quality of the PhysX Xtra implementation by Adobe. :) Anyway. I like to dream of softbodies (deformation & resistance), fluids, volumetric force fields and cloth.[/q] On a Core 2 Quad you can have them all. On an old 2GHz (single-core) processor ... nothing more than a dream. I wonder why Adobe is not able to "resurrect" the relationship with INTEL (and Havok). I wonder who is responsible for choosing Ageia physics (in "software mode") for Shockwave 3D. Anyway, let's close this subject. Time will tell if Adobe is making ...

  1. #21

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: Macromartin
    I'd be more anxious about the quality of the PhysX Xtra implementation by
    Adobe. :)

    Anyway. I like to dream of softbodies (deformation & resistance), fluids,
    volumetric force fields and cloth.[/q]

    On a Core 2 Quad you can have them all.
    On an old 2GHz (single-core) processor ... nothing more than a dream.
    I wonder why Adobe is not able to "resurrect" the relationship with INTEL (and
    Havok).
    I wonder who is responsible for choosing Ageia physics (in "software mode")
    for Shockwave 3D.
    Anyway, let's close this subject.
    Time will tell if Adobe is making the same (marketing) mistakes as Macromedia.

    cheers



    necromanthus Guest

  2. #22

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    >Compared with the old Havox xtra, AGEIA PhysX runs a little bit slower. 
    faster!

    I am very interested to test and compare this inside Director with the
    shockwave3D Engine. Maybe it is possible to tweak here and there to generate
    high framerates.

    The Havok website says:
    "Havok?s cross-platform, professionally supported technology is available for
    the Wii?, PLAYSTATION?3, PLAYSTATION?2, PSP?, Xbox?, Xbox 360?, GameCube?, and
    the PC."

    Seems to be no MacOSX support and this could mean Havok is anyway no option
    for Director anymore.



    hondo3000 Guest

  3. #23

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: hondo3000
    I am very interested to test and compare this inside Director with the
    shockwave3D Engine. Maybe it is possible to tweak here and there to generate
    high framerates. [/q]

    Do you want to double the entire geometry and to use a semi-transparent floor?
    ;)
    Come on Lutz ...

    cheers



    necromanthus Guest

  4. #24

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    >Do you want to double the entire geometry and to use a semi-transparent floor? 

    Still fast, isn't it :) (would really like to test if a realtime mirror shader
    will be faster...)

    The demos i have seen so far from Ageia where quite fast. I downloaded
    "warmonger" and deinstalled it directly after the first try because it is very
    slow and it seems to be designed to run only with ppu. But after deinstalling,
    there are some files left and they can be found in a folder named "Ageia
    Technologies", inside the "bin" folder you can find the following techdemos:
    - AGEIAPhysXBoxes.exe
    - SampleCloth.exe
    - SampleParticleFluid.exe

    Maybe these files are also included when you install the Ageia drivers from
    their website, but i was not able to install them under Vista (maybe they can
    only be installed when the ppu-hardware is connected to the mainboard...)

    hondo3000 Guest

  5. #25

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    http://www.havok.com/content/view/582/53/

    Romeo.Marian Guest

  6. #26

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    Does havok xtra doesn't work with Vista?

    shockland.com Guest

  7. #27

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    Does havok xtra doesn't work with Vista?

    shockland.com Guest

  8. #28

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: scarroll
    Hmm... this doesn't look any better then Director did 5 or 6 years ago.
    Hopefully there are other features that could justify an upgrade (macromix
    audio delay I hear still isn't one of them)...[/q]

    true, the models and textures in the "new" Director 11 game sample leave alot
    to be desired and its not exactly clear how DX9 is implemented. Are there
    additional Lingo terms dealing with DX9 features or are we still to make DX7
    graphics only to be rendered in DX9 as a performance boost? Director simply
    must have things like native additive blending on particle systems and normal
    maps to even start to compete with Unity. A properly functioning reflectionmap
    would be a good start too. I think its a little misleading for Adobe to say
    they've added DX9 support to the sw3d xtra if no DX9 specific features can be
    accessed through Lingo.

    _eyesonly Guest

  9. #29

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    I second that!

    Richard Smith
    www.funpods.com


    "_eyesonly" <com> wrote in message
    news:fpvce1$snn$macromedia.com... 


    Richard Guest

  10. #30

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: hondo3000
    Seems to be no MacOSX support and this could mean Havok is anyway no option
    for Director anymore.
    [/q]

    Havok Physics licensed to Blizzard Entertainment : Diablo 3

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Jeff Yates, Havok's Vice President, Product Management:

    The Mac is an important piece of technology and because of the
    cross-platform nature of Havok's technology, the port to Mac was easy to do.
    Furthermore, Blizzard Entertainment's commitment to OS X and to the Mac
    community is a good indication of the growth potential of the Mac as a games
    platform.
    Blizzard has always put out great games on the Mac, and we look forward to
    Havok becoming a part of that tradition.


    Romeo.Marian Guest

  11. #31

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    I see you're all talking here about the new 3d abilities of Director 11 but
    there is still something I dont understand -
    When I was working with Havok, I need to export an HKE file from 3d Max and
    integrate it in with my w3d member.
    What now? If the Havok Tecnoloy is being replaced, how will I export the 3d
    physic from Max to director?

    net.il

    Yohan Guest

  12. #32

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    As far as i googled, Bizzard ported the havok-engine on their own. Not sure if
    this is ment as a complete port or if they only ported things they need for
    Diablo 3. The havok website does not contain any informations about supporting
    macOSX.

    I am sure that Adobe wanted to get Havok back (at least this was mentioned in
    the SneakPeak of Director11 at AdobeMax2007) but for some reason this did not
    happen. I really hope the relationship between Adobe and Ageia/nVidia will be
    more continuous.

    I tested now "Cellfactor" in softwaremode (Free download on the Ageia
    Website), and it looked (at least for the simple rigidbody physics) quite good.
    video: http://www.biont3d.com/video/ageia_cellfactor/
    (maximum framerate on 25fps because of fraps, without fraps 45fps)
    A scene with comparable amount of colliding models on the same machine will
    not really work with the current havok xtra.
     
    (codes) based on Havok physics with 

    At the moment it works with Vista, but i have no idea if the havok xtra will
    still work in Director11 and with ShockwavePlayer11 (from the technical side it
    should work, but maybe there is some "buisiness"-problem). For the moment there
    is no statement on this topic. Seems that the Adobe people are not allowed to
    use the term "Havok" anymore...

    hondo3000 Guest

  13. #33

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: hondo3000
    As far as i googled, Bizzard ported the havok-engine on their own. Not sure if
    this is ment as a complete port or if they only ported things they need for
    Diablo 3. The havok website does not contain any informations about supporting
    macOSX.[/q]

    A friend of mine owns a copy of Havok 5.5 SDK for MAC OS X.
    Let's close this subject.

    [q]Originally posted by: hondo3000
    A scene with comparable amount of colliding models on the same machine will
    not really work with the current havok xtra.[/q]

    Do not compare Ageia 2.7.4 with the ancient Havok 1.0 !!!
    As I told you before, Havok 5.0 (and 5.5) is 40-60% faster than Ageia 2.7.4
    (and 2.8.0) in software mode.

    Finally:
    Lutz, I don't understand your attitude.
    You're the one who is using Havok in Shockwave 3D. You should defend it.
    I don't use Havok (Ageia is out of question because runs slower) because the
    obsolete SW 3D engine is already full of frame rate issues.
    Besides that, a game based on physics (a racing game for example) is not a
    real challenge for a skilled programmer.
    And that's because the physics is doing more than 50% of the job ...
    ;)

    cheers

    necromanthus Guest

  14. #34

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: hondo3000
    The havok website does not contain any informations about supporting
    macOSX.[/q]

    Did you read (and understand) my previous post?
    Havok SDK is available on MAC OS X starting with version 4.0 (july 2006).

    PS
    Google is not the answer to all our questions...


    Romeo.Marian Guest

  15. #35

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    >Google is not the answer to all our questions...
    Ok, my fault. Still wondering why the havok people don't keep their website
    updated.
     
    Done :)
     

    What should i do? Sign a petition? I think Director11 would be more expensive
    when it would contain a new Havok Xtra. I also have the feeling that the
    mayority of the developers did not use Havok in their shockwave3D projects at
    all and that could be one of the reasons why i had to fish the xtra out of my
    shockwave3D-plugIn-xtras-folder when i wanted to use it with DirectorMX2004.
    The question for me is, will the Ageia Xtra do the job, will it be better than
    what i have now (or at least equal) and will it fit into the needs of
    shockwave3d-online content that has to run on a wide range of different
    machines.

    Instead of having no physics Xtra, i am very happy that there is now one. The
    features that where announced seem to be quite promising and i believe (was not
    able to test it so far) the performance will be good enough.

    hondo3000 Guest

  16. #36

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: hondo3000 

    What should i do? Sign a petition?[/q]

    The W3D Exporter is a default plugin in 3DS Max 2008 thanks to a group of
    'fighters' (Remus is one of them).
    Maybe you should do the same thing if you want Havok back in Director 12.



    AlinaX Guest

  17. #37

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Maybe you should do the same thing if you want Havok back in Director 12.[/q]

    We didn't have physics for years (officially).
    We will get physics in D11 and those will be much better than the old Havok
    physics.
    You didn't test those new Ageia PhysX in Director and already discuss another
    change?
    Director still misses so much, but you already start discussing a "return of
    Havok" before you could test what you'll get in about 3,5 weeks. This is sick,
    really.
    Be happy that you'll get physics. Be happy that you'll get improved physics
    (in comparison to the old Havok Xtra). Complain about other features still
    missing. There's enough to complain about.

    Just my 2 cents,
    Martin

    Macromartin Guest

  18. #38

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    [q]Originally posted by: Macromartin
    you already start discussing a "return of Havok" before you could test what
    you'll get in about 3,5 weeks.
    This is sick, really.
    Be happy that you'll get physics. Be happy that you'll get improved physics
    (in comparison to the old Havok Xtra).[/q]

    Honestly, "better than nothing" is the cheapest approach and sounds sick to me.
    7 years of Havok projects with Director Shockwave doesn't mean anything to
    Adobe Director team?
    I cannot be happy if there is no backward compatibility.

    AlinaX Guest

  19. #39

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    Yes, what about old havok projects? What Adode Director Team suggests us about
    our havok projects?

    Are they saying that "stop using havok xtra and rewrite all of your codes from
    the beginning with the new physics xtra" ?

    I think they are saying this and it will be so hard for me to rewrite them
    from the beginning!!!!

    Regards
    Ege


    shockland.com Guest

  20. #40

    Default Re: Director 11 - AGEIA PhysX 3D engine?

    Before you make assumptions about how the new one works, why don't you
    wait until they release it and then see if the commands are so
    different. It may be that they are quite similar and porting your code
    may be easy. Or not. I suppose we'll have to wait and find out, huh?
    Mike Guest

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