Director MX Online Live Seminar Series

[Thomas Higgins]

All,
Hey folks, I wanted to let everyone know about a pair of free online seminars
that we're having tomorrow in case you're interested. Anyone can attend and so
I'd recommend that folks take a look at the information found at the following
URL:

[url]http://www.macromedia.com/cfusion/event/index.cfm?event=detail&id=1583[/url]

Tomorrow features two seminars, both are introductions to Director MX 2004
each with its own special focus. One session covers the DVD feature in a bit
more detail while the other focuses on Flash integration in this release. For
those that can't attend these seminars, they will be repeated next month as
well. The times listed are only Eastern and Pacific times here in the US,
everyone is welcome so please just adjust these times as necessary based on
your location.

Have a look at the information and please attend if you're interested, thanks!

Cheers,
Tom Higgins
Product Manager - Director Team
Macromedia

...

[necromanthus]

Very interesting TOM.
However, I'm waiting for other 2 seminars:
1) Introducing Director MX 2004 with a Special Focus on the new (DX9
compatible) 3D Engine
2) Introducing Director MX 2004 with a Special Focus on HAVOK 2.0 integration
best regards ... and keep up the good work.

[Thomas Higgins]

I hear you. I too wish we'd get those 3D items sorted out and soon. :( I
don't think there's anything that would please me more than to announce that
we're doing another 3D update, but alas I don't have that to offer right now.
In the meantime, if you have other topics that you would like to see that we
can cover in seminars like these (as in they cover existing features and
functionality) then please tell me what those are so I can see about getting
them scheduled.

Cheers,
Tom Higgins
Product Manager - Director Team
Macromedia

...

[necromanthus]

Glad to hear TOM.
And do you know why ? Because Director can't compete with Flash on the 2D
side. There're (at least) two reasons:
1) Many and many apps are able to produce SWF files
2) The Flash plugin is more "frendly" than ShockWave's plugin (because of the
SW plugin, many potential new customers are gone !)
Now ...
Director is "real" since version 8.5. In other words: without the 3D engine is
dead !
So, the point of attraction is the 3D world (this must be your target for the
next years).
About OnLine Seminars:
Many folks asked me for "W3D tutorials" and "3D LINGO tutorials" (with
examples and demonstrations).
I have not enough spare time to do that, but few Online MM Seminars might
solve their problems.
cheers


Originally posted by: Thomas Higgins
I don't think there's anything that would please me more than to announce that
we're doing another 3D update, but alas I don't have that to offer right now.

Cheers,
Tom Higgins
Product Manager - Director Team
Macromedia

...

[Thomas Higgins]

> And do you know why ?

Do I know why there hasn't been another 3D update? Yes, I do. The truth is
that doing another 3D update is a *massive* effort that since Director 8.5
hasn't been deemed worth the effort. Each release we must always spec out work
to do (the dream feature list), then estimate how much time and how many
engineers each of those will require, then we have to sort out a timeframe when
we want to ship. In the end we must budget our time and resources so that we
get the most from each release. Truth be told doing another major rev of 3D was
deemed less important than doing things like DVD, or JavaScript syntax, or some
of the continued Flash integration work, and that's why it hasn't been done.

Do I necessarily agree with the assessment that it's not worth it? No. Do I
recognize that doing another 3D revision is going to be extremely expensive?
Yes. Please realize that doing 3D alone requires more resources than everything
else we'll do in a release of Director, but will that 3D feature work double
our sales or revenue? No, it won't.

I'm working very hard to come up with ideas on how we can afford to do such
work, on how we can fit a second revision of 3D into another release of
Director, but so far that hasn't panned out yet. :( 3D work is very expensive
and very difficult to do, since Director 8.5 we've focused on work that we feel
benefits a *much* broader range of users, and I think we've done that.

Cheers,
Tom Higgins
Product Manager - Director Team
Macromedia

...

[Bill Wilson]

Tom,

What is Macromedia's current relationship with Intel regarding Shockwave 3D?

Bill

[necromanthus]

Originally posted by: Thomas Higgins
... but will that 3D feature work double our sales or revenue? No, it won't.

Cheers,
Tom Higgins
Product Manager - Director Team
Macromedia

p.s.
for Bill Wilson:
Macromedia's current relationship with Intel regarding Shockwave 3D?
NONE !
But let's wait for Tom's answer ...
cheers


May TRIPLE your sales (but this is my opinion only).
Anyway, thanks for sharing these informations.

[MartyPlumbo]

Heya, Tom.

I'm sure I speak for a lot of Director developers in saying how grateful for
we are for any insights that you can give us regarding the future of Shockwave
3D. So, thanks very much for what you've said here already. I'm sure it's
more than you bargained for when you decided to log in and get the word out
about a couple of cool Director-oriented online seminars. :-)

The thing is, a lot of us believe strongly in the potential of Director's 3D
capabilities not just to revitalize Director, but to ignite new forms of
communication and experience design. Sure, there's already a good deal of
realtime 3D out there, but it's generally not done by smaller-scale developers,
such as those of us in the Director community. Shockwave 3D makes interactive
3D authoring accessible to us, both economically and technologically.

While we can take heart in that the three years since Shockwave 3D's
intoduction have seen the world become a more accommodating home for it (i.e.
more internet bandwidth, better desktop 3D cards, and more 3D-savvy
developers), the bad news is that in that same time, Director's 3D engine has
come to show its age in ways that I don't need to enumerate for this audience.

Sadly, it seems as if you are saying that we can indeed expect to see another
Director version cycle pass without a major update to Shockwave 3D. If so, is
there anything (beyond Director Wish List submissions) that those of us who
really believe in Shockwave 3D can do to help change this?

[Bill Wilson]

> Macromedia's current relationship with Intel regarding Shockwave 3D?

> NONE !
> But let's wait for Tom's answer ...

I think we scared Tom off. : )

Too bad about Intel. Those guys -- the Gary Baldes crew -- were a good
group.

> I'm working very hard to come up with ideas on how we can afford to do

such

> work, on how we can fit a second revision of 3D into another release of
> Director, but so far that hasn't panned out yet. :(

At least it's better to know now that there won't be another update, rather
than to be disappointed each time a new version of Director is announced.

[MartyPlumbo]

Is Gary Blades the guy who led the Intel 3D lab?

Oh well, I agree, good news or bad, at least it's good to know where we stand
with Director and interactive 3D.

I'll see you all over at [url]http://www.garagegames.com[/url]. ;-)

[Agustín María Rodríguez]

MartyPlumbo wrote:

> Is Gary Blades the guy who led the Intel 3D lab?

I know that at least he´s the guy who gave his mail address for being
used by the rest of the Intel SW3D team for answering on the 3D lists.
--
Agustín María Rodríguez | [email]agustin@OnWine.com.ar[/email] | [url]www.OnWine.com.ar[/url]

[Thomas Higgins]

All,
No, I wasn't "scared off", I was just out on vacation for the past week or so.
:) Out working on my tan, snorkeling a bit, y'know, the usual vacation stuff...
But now I'm back and I'll address a few of the dangling items.

First off, what kind of relationship exists between Macromedia and Intel?
As it stands now there's a business relationship as we're still officially
under contract to work with each other, but obviously there hasn't been an
engineering relationship else you'd have noticed a 3D update, right? So we're
still talking about what to do as there is still obvious interest (at least on
Intel's side) in pursuing real-time 3D, but it's a matter of sorting out how to
get there.

Necromanthus: we do differ in our opinions of what revising 3D will do. I just
don't see it tripling our sales yet. That having been said I'm with you folks
on seeing 3D as a _very_important_ technology to push, but it's a matter of
coming up with a business case that allows us to work on it again.

I have never said you won't see another update folks, I'm just not going to
come in here and give a cheerleader's rah-rah speach about things I can't
guarantee. I'm speaking honestly about what the future may or may not hold as I
feel that's what you deserve. If folks desire a sugar coating I'll let them go
to the kitchen and eat cookies. :)

Gary Baldes was one of the Intel engineers. During the D8.5 release and
shortly thereafter Intel had a policy that restricted their engineers from
posting on public lists (not sure if that's still in place or not). Gary was
given permission to subscribe and so a number of their engineering staff ended
up posting under his name, thus his name spread far and wide.

Did I catch everything? If not then let me know and I'll answer any other
questions as I'm now back in the office and working again... <sigh>

Cheers,
Tom Higgins
Product Manager - Director Team
Macromedia

...

[Michaelcov]

I'll see you all over at [url]http://www.garagegames.com[/url]. ;-)

Nope, [url]http://www.adobe.com/products/atmosphere[/url]

I just don't fancy learning another scripting language and software and I have
been given a free version of Adobe Atmosphere for being a loyal tester.

It is dx9 compatable, has dynamic shadows, Havok built in and fast realistic
radiosity lighting if you have a fast pc that is.

Only for Windows though and 2d sprites for HUDS need to be done with Viewpoint
hotspot images.

For games, the only drawback I can see is that you cannot tell if an Viewpoint
hotspot image has loaded or not but maybe a different kind of game could be
done.

If you are a college lecturer, I recommend the educational (fully working)
version for $99. That's Havok, dynamic light shadows, easy radiosity and build
within the program all for $99!

I recommend, download the trial, click on empty solid object, add a floor and
extrude walls from the floor so they all join, add an object that emits light,
then open the lighting panel and light. I certainly went WOW when I did this
first time.

a shameless plug but my Atmo game...
[url]http://www.btinternet.com/~m.j_hall/games.htm[/url]

[necromanthus]

TOM,
Try to follow me: take the Director team and break INTEL headquarter's windows
(LOL).
After that, take them and build a high performance 3D engine for Director.
You'll break the market, I'm sure of that.
cheers

Originally posted by: Thomas Higgins
Necromanthus: we do differ in our opinions of what revising 3D will do. I just
don't see it tripling our sales yet. That having been said I'm with you folks
on seeing 3D as a _very_important_ technology to push, but it's a matter of
coming up with a business case that allows us to work on it again.

[necromanthus]

KARL,
1) We are talking about the 3D engine for ONLINE purposes.
At this time, MacroMedia has no other competitor on this side.
2) 2006 (or 2007 ???) is too late. The current 3D engine MUST be improved SOON.
Is about DirectX 9, pixel shader, hardware AA, more than 50.000 polygons, and
so on.
Is about keeping the current customers first of all !

[Newt99]

You don't seem to get it Necro.

I say that when the OS UI integrate 3D, people will naturally expect 3D on the
web as well. And this won't happen before the release of Windows Longhorn in
2006. By the time people get massively used to 3D thanks to this new release of
Windows, it will be 2007.

You cannot isolate 3D on the web. Remember that IE is tightly integrated with
Windows, which is why both the United States Supreme Court and the European
Union sued them.

3D on the desktop will enable 3D on the web.
It's not about what you want, it's about what will happen.

Karl.

[necromanthus]

3 years using DirectX 7 ??? I don't think so !
Besides that, many people have the pre-release version of Win LongHorn
allready.
And belive me: is not such a big deal !
It's not about what I want, is about "to be and remain on the top" !
And this is not so easy ...
cheers

[Newt99]

I'm well aware that Windows Longhorn will not be a great OS and a great UI. I
know someone who got it in beta too. It will never reach the level of
excellence of the Apple Aqua UI on MacOS X. Besides, I expect Windows Longhorn
to be heavy and buggy.

But what matters is the introduction of 3D to the masses through the OS UI,
which serves our purpose.

A further evidence of the 2006 forecast is the U3D format for Universal 3D, an
ECMA/ISO standard to come by Intel (again). The efforts made by Adobe, ATI,
Boeing, Dassault, Intel, Microsoft et Hewlett-Packard (etc...) will not come to
fruition before 2006 according to the roadmap.

We all agree on the fact Shockwave 3D needs an update now, but it won't
happen. So don't strike your head against the wall (it hurts !). Instead, buy
Virtools or Yappa now and come back in 2006/2007 to see what Macromedia will be
able to do then based on Windows Longhorn and the U3D format.

Cheers,
Karl.

[necromanthus]

Originally posted by: Karl S
Buy Virtools or Yappa now and come back in 2006/2007 to see what Macromedia
will be able to do then based on Windows Longhorn and the U3D format.

Really ? WOW.
Are you trying to steal from MM's customers ?
That's fine with me, but I have to remind you that this is their forum !
cheers
p.s.
we're out of subject here. I don't wanna continue this (interesting) "fight"
cheers

[Newt99]

Every so often, someone on this forum asks for an alternate solution. People
at Macromedia know Shockwave 3D is outdated. So there is no shame in discussing
about other solutions on this forum, even if it's Macromedia's.

There are many people at Macromedia who think Virtools is a very good app.
Actually, had Intel not signed with Macromedia, the Shockwave 3D engine could
have been Virtools' instead.

I'm still faithful to Macromedia and I keep going developing Flash games right
now.
Have you seen many Web3D job opportunities lately ? I haven't since 2002.

Karl.