Elements "pasted inside" change position when parent group is re-sized

[JohnSplash webforumsuser@macromedia.com]

Anyone else have this problem?

I've got a fairly complex logo -- all vector elements created in FH (11.01). The group includes several sub-groups, and some nested elements have objects "pasted inside" (i.e., clip path). If I re-size the entire group, the elements that are pasted inside change their relationship to their clip path (parent). Each time I re-size, they move farther from their original position inside the clip path, eventually disappearing altogether. The elements don't all move the same direction or the same amount.

This is reproducible and very consistent with this particular logo, and has happened before with other projects and in previous versions of Freehand (8 & 9, at least). Doesn't happen with every complex group, but this is extremely frustrating. In the current case, every time I layout a new piece and re-size the logo, I have to manually move a dozen paths to fix it.

I'm sure I can export as an EPS and import it back in, but this is one of those basic functions that I expect to work absolutely perfectly in any serious illustration program. Frustrating that it hasn't been addressed previously.

[Judy Arndt]

JohnSplash wrote:

> I've got a fairly complex logo -- all vector elements created in FH (11.01).
> The group includes several sub-groups, and some nested elements have objects
> "pasted inside" (i.e., clip path). If I re-size the entire group, the
> elements that are pasted inside change their relationship to their clip path
> (parent). Each time I re-size, they move farther from their original position
> inside the clip path, eventually disappearing altogether. The elements don't
> all move the same direction or the same amount.

First, make sure that you have 'contents' selected in the Transform/Scale
panel.

If that doesn't solve the problem, is there any chance that you have a live
envelope on any of the objects? I've seen similar weirdness when trying to
scale lettering inside a perspective grid envelope.

Do you have 'transform as unit' turned on for any of the elements at any
level? It shouldn't cause a problem, but sometimes produces unexpected
behavior.

Judy Arndt

[JohnSplash webforumsuser@macromedia.com]

Yes, "contents" is checked. No envelopes.

Where is "transform as unit"? Seems like I've seen it before, but I can't find it, it's not referenced in the online "manual".

Thanks for your help.

[Ken Kehl]

Check the settings in the Transform panel. The 'Contents' box needs to
have a checkmark in it if the objects are to retain their relationship
with their container when they are resized.
______
Ken
ellipsis design
(remove the _xx_'s)

[Judy Arndt]

When you say 'resize', how are you scaling -- with the scale tool, transform
handles, object inspector or Find & Replace Graphic > Scale?

I suspect some kind of corruption in your logo. The 'Transform as unit'
checkbox is in the Object inspector when a group is selected, but I doubt
that's the issue here unless the info is corrupt. Another source of
corruption can be faulty 'remember layer info' data attached to groups.

To clear corruption in existing artwork:
1. Turn off the prefs 'remember layer info' and 'groups transform as unit by
default'.

2. Copy the logo to a new document.

3. Cut contents, ungroup groups, split and rejoin composite paths. Reduce
the number of nested groups. Reduce the number of clipping paths if
possible.

4. Put it all back together in FHMXa with new Group and Paste Inside
commands, not undo's. I think you'll find you can clear up the problems.

Judy Arndt

PS: Ken Kehl, good to see your name on the forum again. :-)

JohnSplash wrote:

> Yes, "contents" is checked. No envelopes.
>
> Where is "transform as unit"? Seems like I've seen it before, but I can't
> find it, it's not referenced in the online "manual".
>
> Thanks for your help.
>

[Judy Arndt]

JohnSplash, are you still around?

The recently reported overprint display problem makes me wonder if yours is
similar problem. Does you logo appear incorrect after scaling in both
Preview and Fast Preview modes?

Judy Arndt