Professional Web Applications Themes

Email Harvesting - Ruby

I've been receiving a lot of Swen emails to my ruby-talk address lately. This mailing alias is rather new and so my guess is that this list is actively being harvested for emails. Is there something we can do to fix this? This is getting boring, my email bandwidth quota is being eaten by these goddam 150kb emails. nikolai -- ::: name: Nikolai Weibull :: aliases: pcp / lone-star / aka ::: ::: born: Chicago, IL USA :: loc atm: Gothenburg, Sweden ::: ::: page: [url]www.pcppopper.org[/url] :: fun atm: gf,lps,ruby,lisp,war3 ::: main(){printf(&linux[" 1%six

2

Thread: Email Harvesting

"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);}...

  1. #1

    Default Email Harvesting

    I've been receiving a lot of Swen emails to my ruby-talk address lately.
    This mailing alias is rather new and so my guess is that this list is
    actively being harvested for emails. Is there something we can do to
    fix this? This is getting boring, my email bandwidth quota is being
    eaten by these goddam 150kb emails.
    nikolai

    --
    ::: name: Nikolai Weibull :: aliases: pcp / lone-star / aka :::
    ::: born: Chicago, IL USA :: loc atm: Gothenburg, Sweden :::
    ::: page: [url]www.pcppopper.org[/url] :: fun atm: gf,lps,ruby,lisp,war3 :::
    main(){printf(&linux["\021%six\012\0"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);}

    Nikolai Weibull Guest

  2. #2

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    Hi,
    > I've been receiving a lot of Swen emails to my ruby-talk address
    > lately.
    > This mailing alias is rather new and so my guess is that this list is
    > actively being harvested for emails. Is there something we can do to
    > fix this? This is getting boring, my email bandwidth quota is being
    > eaten by these goddam 150kb emails.
    That's because this list is mirrored to usenet (see
    [url]http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&group=comp.lang.ruby[/url]
    ) with all email addresses intact. I also find this annoying, and
    wasn't aware of the fact when I subscribed (probably because I didn't
    read the fine print).

    Possible solutions, none of which I find appealing:
    - Stop mirroring the list to usenet: Would keep usenet users from
    participating
    - Remove email addresses from posts before mirroring: Makes it harder
    to reply off-list
    - Set up another list that isn't mirrored
    - Use the list via usenet using a fake email address

    Cheers,
    -Ralph.


    Ralph Pöllath Guest

  3. #3

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    Ralph Pöllath wrote:
    ....
    > Possible solutions, none of which I find appealing:
    > - Stop mirroring the list to usenet: Would keep usenet users from
    > participating
    > - Remove email addresses from posts before mirroring: Makes it harder
    > to reply off-list
    > - Set up another list that isn't mirrored
    > - Use the list via usenet using a fake email address
    How about this solution: Create a dedicated (non-brain dead) free email
    account: In the anti-spam option section mark appropriate setting to
    refuse accepting emails flagged as spam. Put ruby-talk (and possible other)
    email address(es) in the white-list and everything else (meaning
    everything)
    in the blacklist. For accepting off list mail adjust the return address of
    your
    dedicated ruby-talk account to
    [email]myremove_this_partreal_emailaddress.com[/email] and
    add a signature like

    ----
    Send off list replies to
    [email]myremove_this_partreal_emailaddress.com[/email]
    where you remove the "remove_this_part"
    ---

    /Christoph


    Christoph Guest

  4. #4

    Default Re: Email Harvesting


    "Nikolai Weibull" <ruby-talkpcppopper.org> wrote:
    > This is getting boring, my email bandwidth quota is being
    > eaten by these goddam 150kb emails.
    > nikolai
    >

    See ...
    [url]http://www.rubygarden.org/ruby?SoBigPopper[/url] (for Swen)

    Just replace three parameters with your local details.

    POP3Filter.new("server", "user", "pass").process
    (near end of script)

    It offers to delete Swen-alikes from your mail-server.
    e.g. Run it before starting your mail reader.

    ( Continues to be very useful to me. Thanks, guys. )


    daz



    daz Guest

  5. #5

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 21:30:21 +0900, Ralph Pöllath wrote:
    > Hi,
    >> I've been receiving a lot of Swen emails to my ruby-talk address
    >> lately. This mailing alias is rather new and so my guess is that
    >> this list is actively being harvested for emails. Is there
    >> something we can do to fix this? This is getting boring, my email
    >> bandwidth quota is being eaten by these goddam 150kb emails.
    > That's because this list is mirrored to usenet [...] with all
    > email addresses intact. I also find this annoying, and wasn't
    > aware of the fact when I subscribed (probably because I didn't
    > read the fine print).
    This has nothing to do with it. I've got a dedicated usenet address
    and it gets far less spam than any other address I have (and this
    was even true when I was far more active in newsgroups than I am
    now). People like to blame this on the news gateway, but that's not
    it at all.

    Look instead to web archives (e.g., [url]www.ruby-talk.org[/url]).

    -austin
    --
    austin ziegler * [email]austinhalostatue.ca[/email] * Toronto, ON, Canada
    software designer * pragmatic programmer * 2003.10.21
    * 13.31.21


    Austin Ziegler Guest

  6. #6

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    * Austin Ziegler <austinhalostatue.ca> [Oct, 21 2003 19:40]:
    > Look instead to web archives (e.g., [url]www.ruby-talk.org[/url]).
    yes, this is also not very good. i'm betting this generates a lot more
    problems than the usenet stuff. i don't think spammers bother too much
    with parsing emails from usenet. would it be possible for someone to
    take care of this?
    nikolai

    --
    ::: name: Nikolai Weibull :: aliases: pcp / lone-star / aka :::
    ::: born: Chicago, IL USA :: loc atm: Gothenburg, Sweden :::
    ::: page: [url]www.pcppopper.org[/url] :: fun atm: gf,lps,ruby,lisp,war3 :::
    main(){printf(&linux["\021%six\012\0"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);}

    Nikolai Weibull Guest

  7. #7

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    Nikolai Weibull said:
    > with parsing emails from usenet. would it be possible for someone to
    > take care of this?
    My $.02 = Attempting to hide all the emails does more harm than good... it
    really only makes it harder for people to contact you who have a genuine
    reason to do so (i.e. - with a Ruby question). As far as spam goes, not
    publishing your email address certainly helps, but the first time a friend
    or relative sends you an electronic "greeting card" you're sunk.

    Perhaps the effort would be better spent on improving anti-spam systems...
    Personally, I find the Bayesian-ish approach of bogofilter to be quite
    good. I catch ~100 spams per day & only one or two get through. More
    attention (and contributions) to projects like this would improve the
    situation much more than going through web archives & mangling email
    addresses.

    -Ryan

    --
    Ryan Dlugosz
    [email]ryandlugosz.net[/email]

    [url]http://dlugosz.net[/url]

    Ryan Dlugosz Guest

  8. #8

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    Ryan Dlugosz wrote:
    > Nikolai Weibull said:
    >
    >>with parsing emails from usenet. would it be possible for someone
    to
    >>take care of this?
    >
    > My $.02 = Attempting to hide all the emails does more harm than
    good... it
    > really only makes it harder for people to contact you who have a
    genuine
    > reason to do so (i.e. - with a Ruby question). As far as spam
    goes, not
    > publishing your email address certainly helps, but the first time a
    friend
    > or relative sends you an electronic "greeting card" you're sunk.
    >
    > Perhaps the effort would be better spent on improving anti-spam
    systems...

    I tend to agree here. Spam s and I hate it as much as the next
    guy,
    but I don't expect (nor do I trust, really), anyone but me to do
    something about _my_ spam, and hiding my email address isn't any real

    answer.





    __________________________________
    Do you Yahoo!?
    The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
    [url]http://shopping.[/url]

    Michael Campbell Guest

  9. #9

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    Ryan Dlugosz said:
    >My $.02 = Attempting to hide all the emails does more harm than good...
    >it really only makes it harder for people to contact you who have a
    >genuine reason to do so (i.e. - with a Ruby question).
    I agree that email mangling causes as many problems as it solves,
    however there's another possibility. I don't recall the name of the
    approach, but I've seen systems where you're presented with a graphic
    containing a word (and a mangled background to foil OCR) and you must
    type it into a form in order to get access to a web system. The idea is
    to ensure that it is a real person viewing the web archive rather than a
    spammer's harvesting bot.

    Would something like that be an acceptable compromise? Who's in charge
    of the web archive?

    -Greg Vaughn



    Greg Vaughn Guest

  10. #10

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    Problem is that it makes Google useless for searching the archives.
    Apple's mailing lists do something similar but less secure, and it
    neatly eliminates them as a useful repository of knowledge (Apple's own
    list archive and search UI being almost completely useless).

    Chris

    On Oct 21, 2003, at 2:43 PM, Greg Vaughn wrote:
    > Ryan Dlugosz said:
    > >My $.02 = Attempting to hide all the emails does more harm than
    > good...
    > >it really only makes it harder for people to contact you who have a
    > >genuine reason to do so (i.e. - with a Ruby question).
    >
    > I agree that email mangling causes as many problems as it solves,
    > however there's another possibility. I don't recall the name of the
    > approach, but I've seen systems where you're presented with a graphic
    > containing a word (and a mangled background to foil OCR) and you must
    > type it into a form in order to get access to a web system. The idea
    > is to ensure that it is a real person viewing the web archive rather
    > than a spammer's harvesting bot.
    >
    > Would something like that be an acceptable compromise? Who's in charge
    > of the web archive?
    >
    > -Greg Vaughn
    >
    >

    Chris Thomas Guest

  11. #11

    Default [OT] CAPTCHA (was Re: Email Harvesting

    On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 06:43:41 +0900, Greg Vaughn wrote:
    > I agree that email mangling causes as many problems as it solves, however
    > there's another possibility. I don't recall the name of the approach, but
    > I've seen systems where you're presented with a graphic containing a word
    > (and a mangled background to foil OCR) and you must type it into a form in
    > order to get access to a web system. The idea is to ensure that it is a
    > real person viewing the web archive rather than a spammer's harvesting
    > bot.
    >
    It's called CAPTCHA, Completely Automated Public Turing Test to Tell
    Computers and Humans Apart. See [url]http://www.captcha.net[/url].


    Tim Hunter Guest

  12. #12

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, Greg Vaughn wrote:
    > approach, but I've seen systems where you're presented with a graphic
    > containing a word (and a mangled background to foil OCR) and you must
    > type it into a form in order to get access to a web system. The idea is
    > to ensure that it is a real person viewing the web archive rather than a
    > spammer's harvesting bot.
    Yes, see October DDJ for one, but do we really want to exclude blind
    people :-) ? And possibly dyslexic people as well....
    >
    > -Greg Vaughn
    >
    Hugh

    Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng Guest

  13. #13

    Default Re: [OT] CAPTCHA (was Re: Email Harvesting

    Tim Hunter wrote:
    > It's called CAPTCHA, Completely Automated Public Turing Test to Tell
    > Computers and Humans Apart. See [url]http://www.captcha.net[/url].
    Ok, that was depressing. I just tried the gimpy test and failed TWICE.
    Guess I'm a bot then. Or need stronger glasses. :P

    --
    (\[ Kent Dahl ]/)_ _~_ _____[ [url]http://www.pvv.org/~kentda/[/url] ]_____/~
    ))\_student_/(( \__d L b__/ Master of Science in Technology )
    ( \__\_õ|õ_/__/ ) _)Industrial economics and technological management(
    \____/_ö_\____/ (____engineering.discipline_=_Computer::Technology ___)

    Kent Dahl Guest

  14. #14

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    * Ryan Dlugosz <ryandlugosz.net> [Oct, 22 2003 10:26]:
    > Nikolai Weibull said:
    > > with parsing emails from usenet. would it be possible for someone to
    > > take care of this?
    >
    > My $.02 = Attempting to hide all the emails does more harm than good... it
    > really only makes it harder for people to contact you who have a genuine
    > reason to do so (i.e. - with a Ruby question). As far as spam goes, not
    > publishing your email address certainly helps, but the first time a friend
    > or relative sends you an electronic "greeting card" you're sunk.
    >
    > Perhaps the effort would be better spent on improving anti-spam systems...
    > Personally, I find the Bayesian-ish approach of bogofilter to be quite
    > good. I catch ~100 spams per day & only one or two get through. More
    > attention (and contributions) to projects like this would improve the
    > situation much more than going through web archives & mangling email
    > addresses.
    Hey, I don't have problems capturing spam, I just don't want it reaching
    me, period. Parsing out email addresses does make it harder to respond
    to people, yes, and that is often not a problem. If you're mailing to a
    mailing list, you expect people to reply to the mailing list, not the
    email address you sent from. And if people really want to contact you,
    they can probably understand the pd email, such as
    ruby-talk at pcppopper dot org
    or some less obvious parsing,
    nikolai

    --
    ::: name: Nikolai Weibull :: aliases: pcp / lone-star / aka :::
    ::: born: Chicago, IL USA :: loc atm: Gothenburg, Sweden :::
    ::: page: [url]www.pcppopper.org[/url] :: fun atm: gf,lps,ruby,lisp,war3 :::
    main(){printf(&linux["\021%six\012\0"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);}

    Nikolai Weibull Guest

  15. #15

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 08:35:32 +0900, Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng
    <hgsdmu.ac.uk> wrote:
    > On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, Greg Vaughn wrote:
    >
    > > approach, but I've seen systems where you're presented with a graphic
    > > containing a word (and a mangled background to foil OCR) and you must
    > > type it into a form in order to get access to a web system. The idea is
    > > to ensure that it is a real person viewing the web archive rather than a
    > > spammer's harvesting bot.
    >
    > Yes, see October DDJ for one, but do we really want to exclude blind
    > people :-) ? And possibly dyslexic people as well....
    Another disadvantage of such a system is that it will prevent people
    from searching the archives with google. (most of the times when i
    searched something about ruby, google would give me a relevant post in
    the web archives) Then wouldn't it be better render the email-address
    of the poster as a graphic ?

    Ruben

    Ruben Vandeginste Guest

  16. #16

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    * Ruben Vandeginste <Ruben.Vandeginstecs.kuleuven.ac.be> [Oct, 22 2003 11:10]:
    > Another disadvantage of such a system is that it will prevent people
    > from searching the archives with google. (most of the times when i
    > searched something about ruby, google would give me a relevant post in
    > the web archives) Then wouldn't it be better render the email-address
    > of the poster as a graphic ?
    can someone please, please describe the issues associated with mangling
    the email address? is this too hard for people reading this list to
    understand?
    ruby-talk at pcppopper dot org
    or
    [email]ruby-talknospam.pcppopper.org[/email]
    and then having a note on the front page saying that you must remove the
    nospam. part from email addresses?
    or some similar scheme?
    nikolai

    --
    ::: name: Nikolai Weibull :: aliases: pcp / lone-star / aka :::
    ::: born: Chicago, IL USA :: loc atm: Gothenburg, Sweden :::
    ::: page: [url]www.pcppopper.org[/url] :: fun atm: gf,lps,ruby,lisp,war3 :::
    main(){printf(&linux["\021%six\012\0"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);}

    Nikolai Weibull Guest

  17. #17

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, Ruben Vandeginste wrote:
    > On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 08:35:32 +0900, Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng
    > <hgsdmu.ac.uk> wrote:
    >
    > > On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, Greg Vaughn wrote:
    > >
    > > > approach, but I've seen systems where you're presented with a graphic
    > > > containing a word (and a mangled background to foil OCR) and you must
    [...]
    > > Yes, see October DDJ for one, but do we really want to exclude blind
    > > people :-) ? And possibly dyslexic people as well....
    >
    > Another disadvantage of such a system is that it will prevent people
    > from searching the archives with google. (most of the times when i
    > searched something about ruby, google would give me a relevant post in
    Yes, agreed.
    > the web archives) Then wouldn't it be better render the email-address
    > of the poster as a graphic ?
    <sigh>. People went to a lot of trouble to make SVG accessible to
    screen readers, braille displays and the like. You are proposing the
    opposite.

    Is there really some reason why a password cannot be used to gain
    access to the addresses in a message, with a lowish limit of 10 per
    day or something? Abuse would be easy to detect.
    >
    > Ruben
    >
    Hugh

    Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng Guest

  18. #18

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 18:34:32 +0900, Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng
    <hgsdmu.ac.uk> wrote:
    > > the web archives) Then wouldn't it be better render the email-address
    > > of the poster as a graphic ?
    >
    > <sigh>. People went to a lot of trouble to make SVG accessible to
    > screen readers, braille displays and the like. You are proposing the
    > opposite.
    agreed. but i thought that it wouldn't be that much of a problem if
    the screen readers can't access the poster's email address. i also
    think that it's not possible to make the email address accessible to
    screen readers, but not to email harvesters through obfuscation.

    Obfuscation by using things like 'ruby-talk at pcppopper dot org' or
    'ruby-talknospam.pcppopper.org' is probably not that effective in
    hiding addresses from mail harvesters. This kind of things has already
    been in use for such a long time, you'd expect mail harvesters to take
    into account these things...
    > Is there really some reason why a password cannot be used to gain
    > access to the addresses in a message, with a lowish limit of 10 per
    > day or something? Abuse would be easy to detect.
    Your idea sounds good, but probably involves a lot of work for the
    person who has to implement it (just as the other ideas mentioned i
    guess).

    Ruben

    PS. i've been completely 'Swen'-free for over a week now, but guess
    what, right after my post on the mailing list i recieved 4
    'Swen's.. coincidence ? don't think so...

    Ruben Vandeginste Guest

  19. #19

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    * Ruben Vandeginste [Oct, 22 2003 13:40]:
    > PS. i've been completely 'Swen'-free for over a week now, but guess
    > what, right after my post on the mailing list i recieved 4
    > 'Swen's.. coincidence ? don't think so...
    heh, ok, so either we have a harvester, or some #!#!$^ on the list is
    distributing Swen to us? I recently had to change my email provider and
    address, since my old account got totally destroyed by Swen when it was
    launched. Now, the only address i get Swen to still is the address I'm
    using now. It's sad that it has to be this way, I don't want to leave
    this mailing list, especially not by outside force,
    nikolai

    --
    ::: name: Nikolai Weibull :: aliases: pcp / lone-star / aka :::
    ::: born: Chicago, IL USA :: loc atm: Gothenburg, Sweden :::
    ::: page: [url]www.pcppopper.org[/url] :: fun atm: gf,lps,ruby,lisp,war3 :::
    main(){printf(&linux["\021%six\012\0"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);}

    Nikolai Weibull Guest

  20. #20

    Default Re: Email Harvesting

    On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, Ruben Vandeginste wrote:
    > On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 18:34:32 +0900, Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng
    > > <sigh>. People went to a lot of trouble to make SVG accessible to
    > > screen readers, braille displays and the like. You are proposing the
    > > opposite.
    >
    > agreed. but i thought that it wouldn't be that much of a problem if
    > the screen readers can't access the poster's email address. i also
    Not much of a problem for whom?
    > think that it's not possible to make the email address accessible to
    > screen readers, but not to email harvesters through obfuscation.
    >
    "aGdzQGRtdS5hYy51aw==".unpack("m*")

    Then theres .reverse, .tr, .swapcase,....

    A screen reader can tell you there is ruby code there, even if you
    have to push it into irb yourself to get the answer. This leaves the
    user in the same position as sighted people. That seems fair to my
    way of thinking.
    >
    Hugh

    Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng Guest

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Connenting email form to an email account
    By evaughn in forum Macromedia Dynamic HTML
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: February 15th, 04:00 AM
  2. Group email doesn't send because of bad email
    By hecsan in forum Coldfusion - Advanced Techniques
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: July 11th, 08:43 PM
  3. Replies: 5
    Last Post: July 21st, 05:46 PM
  4. Replies: 2
    Last Post: June 16th, 07:48 PM
  5. how to if then else with email new to asp
    By Ken Schaefer in forum ASP
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: August 28th, 08:52 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •