Freehand is Dead - Switched to InDesign

[freshbrand]

Freehand is dead. I have been using Freehand since v.3 and used it for
everything: logos, environmental graphics, vehicle graphics, web sites,
brochures even used it to design a monthly magazine with over 100 pages, never
even bothered with Quark. Macromedia has abandoned the print designers that
supported them all these years in favor for the big cash cow "web/flash"
design. Just switched to InDesign and I'm very happy with it, should have done
it long ago, would have saved myself a lot of money and time.

So "Goodbey Macromedia" I suppose we all have to choose who we support.
Marcel

[John Waller]

Freehand's competitor in the Adobe stable is Illustrator.

Both are for vector illustration.

InDesign is a page layout program with some vector illustration
capabilities.

--
Regards

John Waller

[Martin Sammtleben]

In article <cc76nb$k4l$1@forums.macromedia.com>,
"freshbrand" <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

> Just switched to InDesign and I'm very happy with it, should have done
> it long ago, would have saved myself a lot of money and time.

And are you perhaps missing some familiar tools ?

Was this post meant to be serious ??

--
Cheers Martin

[David Plank]

Gee, I would like to see some graphics and web sites you do with
Indesign.

dp

freshbrand wrote:

> Freehand is dead. I have been using Freehand since v.3 and used it for
> everything: logos, environmental graphics, vehicle graphics, web sites,
> brochures even used it to design a monthly magazine with over 100 pages, never
> even bothered with Quark. Macromedia has abandoned the print designers that
> supported them all these years in favor for the big cash cow "web/flash"
> design. Just switched to InDesign and I'm very happy with it, should have done
> it long ago, would have saved myself a lot of money and time.
>
> So "Goodbey Macromedia" I suppose we all have to choose who we support.
> Marcel
>

[Percival Prim]

I couldn't agree more! I tried InDesign and it was far far better! The rest
of you guys should give it a try... you might be surprised; I was! :)

PP

[veeall]

i like to work with freehand(MX). i have moved over to ID with all my layout projects, if FH gets its unicode support and reliable text handling i?d prefer FH again for brochures probably.

[Wes Rand]

Percival Prim wrote:

> I couldn't agree more! I tried InDesign and it was far far better! The rest
> of you guys should give it a try... you might be surprised; I was! :)
>
> PP
>
>

I use both. This ain't no competition.

[Percival Prim]

Do you have the latest version Wes? I'm assuming you don't. If you did i'm
sure your attitude would be different.

Try downloading a trial - you won't go back!

PP

[Judy Arndt]

Just curious Percival. Do you use InDesign to create complex illustrations
from scratch? Do you create technical drawings, maps, logos?

Do you produce packaging in a variety of shapes and sizes?

Do you receive client-supplied files in CMYK or RGB colors, and rework them
for spot color output in a different medium with different technical
requirements?

Judy Arndt

Percival Prim wrote:

> Do you have the latest version Wes? I'm assuming you don't. If you did i'm
> sure your attitude would be different.
>
> Try downloading a trial - you won't go back!

[Wes Rand]

Percival Prim wrote:

> Do you have the latest version Wes? I'm assuming you don't. If you did i'm
> sure your attitude would be different.
>

Yes, got the latest version of both programs. So what is your point?
Freehand can do many things InDesign can't. InDesign can do many things
that Freehand can't. And I need both programs to do everything I need to
do. I also use Photoshop, Painter and Flash but none is an all-in-one
answer for dealing with the design problems I encounter.

[Percival Prim]

Wes:

What you need is the HandsFree Plugin which enables InDesign to achieve
everything freehand is capable of plus the extra's your already aware of. In
the earlier versions i myself possessed a copy of both InDesign and
Freehand, but in the new version the facility is there for this plugin which
then nullified my need for Freehand.
I don't think this discussion is pointing to InDesign as an all-in-one
solution. Photoshop is in a completely different bracket, along with
flash...etc. Thats like comparing Dreamweaver to Flash. Two DIFFERENT
programs! My point is that InDesign can do everything freehand can do (with
the plugin mentioned) and more and IMHO better!

Judy:

Yes to the first two questions. I create all kinds of various shapes and
sizes with little effort. I create a lot of floor/electrical plans for
interior design i do. I hate maps, but yes i do them on occasion (not that
InDesign has a problem, i just hate doing them). And ofcourse logo's all the
time.

As to your third question... i'm not sure what that has to do with InDesign.
I recieve files from clients like any other designer + then use Photoshop to
convert them to CMYK/RGB/GREY...etc. Whatever the specification, i produce
that in Photoshop first, and then import it into InDesign.

PP


p.s. Where has freshbread gone??? He/She started this discussion but has had
no input since...

[Getho]

whats this hands free plugin - is it multiplatform? I recently swapped from
primarily using FH to illustrator - with FX for some identity design, Sounds
like I shouldv'e spent my time learning indesign???

Getho


"Percival Prim" <spamwonderfulspam@python.com> wrote in message
news:ccjks4$b3l$1@forums.macromedia.com...

> Wes:
>
> What you need is the HandsFree Plugin which enables InDesign to achieve
> everything freehand is capable of plus the extra's your already aware of.

In

> the earlier versions i myself possessed a copy of both InDesign and
> Freehand, but in the new version the facility is there for this plugin

which

> then nullified my need for Freehand.
> I don't think this discussion is pointing to InDesign as an all-in-one
> solution. Photoshop is in a completely different bracket, along with
> flash...etc. Thats like comparing Dreamweaver to Flash. Two DIFFERENT
> programs! My point is that InDesign can do everything freehand can do

(with

> the plugin mentioned) and more and IMHO better!
>
> Judy:
>
> Yes to the first two questions. I create all kinds of various shapes and
> sizes with little effort. I create a lot of floor/electrical plans for
> interior design i do. I hate maps, but yes i do them on occasion (not that
> InDesign has a problem, i just hate doing them). And ofcourse logo's all

the

> time.
>
> As to your third question... i'm not sure what that has to do with

InDesign.

> I recieve files from clients like any other designer + then use Photoshop

to

> convert them to CMYK/RGB/GREY...etc. Whatever the specification, i produce
> that in Photoshop first, and then import it into InDesign.
>
> PP
>
>
> p.s. Where has freshbread gone??? He/She started this discussion but has

had

> no input since...
>
>

[Getho]

> p.s. Where has freshbread gone??? He/She started this discussion but has
had

> no input since...
>

to the adobe forums???

[Rich Hudgins]

A link to HandsFree would be appreciated. I cannot find it anywhere,
including the InDesign Third Party PlugIn page.

Rich

Percival Prim wrote:

> Wes:
>
> What you need is the HandsFree Plugin which enables InDesign to achieve
> everything freehand is capable of plus the extra's your already aware of.

[Judy Arndt]

Percival Prim wrote:

> As to your third question... i'm not sure what that has to do with InDesign.
> I recieve files from clients like any other designer + then use Photoshop to
> convert them to CMYK/RGB/GREY...etc. Whatever the specification, i produce
> that in Photoshop first, and then import it into InDesign.

I was not referring to changing the mode of raster images, which I also do
in Photoshop. I frequently repurpose CMYK _vector art_ for output to spot
color separations. For me, FreeHand's 'Name All Colors' and 'Find & Replace
Graphics' are fast and accurate. I love FreeHand's entire suite of Find &
Replace tools.

If you're happy doing all your drawing in InDesign, fine. If InDesign has
specific _drawing_ features that you feel FreeHand lacks, then discuss those
features. Slamming FreeHand, without giving any details, on a
Macromedia-provided forum is about as classy as attending a party for the
sole purpose of insulting the host.

Judy Arndt
(FreeHand user since version 2)

[Getho]

So do I, when they work!

Geth


"Judy Arndt" <jarndt@shawbiz.ca> wrote in message
news:BD12CE0C.1E419%jarndt@shawbiz.ca...

> Percival Prim wrote:
>

> > As to your third question... i'm not sure what that has to do with

InDesign.

> > I recieve files from clients like any other designer + then use

Photoshop to

> > convert them to CMYK/RGB/GREY...etc. Whatever the specification, i

produce

> > that in Photoshop first, and then import it into InDesign.

>
> I was not referring to changing the mode of raster images, which I also do
> in Photoshop. I frequently repurpose CMYK _vector art_ for output to spot
> color separations. For me, FreeHand's 'Name All Colors' and 'Find &

Replace

> Graphics' are fast and accurate. I love FreeHand's entire suite of Find &
> Replace tools.
>
> If you're happy doing all your drawing in InDesign, fine. If InDesign has
> specific _drawing_ features that you feel FreeHand lacks, then discuss

those

> features. Slamming FreeHand, without giving any details, on a
> Macromedia-provided forum is about as classy as attending a party for the
> sole purpose of insulting the host.
>
> Judy Arndt
> (FreeHand user since version 2)
>

[Ken Kehl]

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 11:56:15 -0400, Rich Hudgins
<rich@nospam-weiss-associates.com> wrote:

> A link to HandsFree would be appreciated. I cannot find it anywhere,
> including the InDesign Third Party PlugIn page.

I couldn't find it either. I think someone is pulling our leg. Is it
April 1 already?
__________

Ken

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

[art101]

Couldn't help myself... after another day in software hell, I just had to wade
in.

In response to freshbrand / Marcel's original statement - "Freehand is dead" -
I can certainly empathize. But I don't think it's just FreeHand that's dead...
I think maybe the whole illustration and page layout software thing is in big
trouble. FreeHand isn't dead, it just smells funny.

I bought my first version of FreeHand eons ago, back in the late '80s; version
1.0 (not trying to trump Judy's version 2.0 here, just trying to add another
perspective). I still have that old floppy disk and the purple manual with the
really ugly cover art and bad typography. Back then, FreeHand was owned by a
company called Aldus... a company which pretty much launched the desktop
publishing revolution. I used to talk on the phone with its founder now and
then.

In my humble opinion, FreeHand 3.0 for Mac absolutely kicked ass. It was
evolved (but not too much), pretty clean, fairly stable, intuitive, and
surprisingly powerful. If I owned Macromedia, I'd re-release it and call it
something inane like "FreeHand Lite." I used it to make my first real piece of
digital fine art... a 70-inch wide drawing of a 1957 T-Bird called "To Die For"
(see: [url]http://www.art101.com/gallery/tdf.htm[/url]).

Back then, I spent lots of time learning how to draw with a mouse... it felt
kinda weird at first, like trying to draw with a bar of soap. But I was happy
and alive and open to all possibilities. During those early, heady days, I made
some art for a magazine called "Before & After" (see: [url]http://www.pagelab.com[/url]).

So anyway, here's my point. All illustration software, be it FreeHand, or
Illustrator, or Corel, or whatever, has become way too convoluted and
difficult. Everything is loaded with "features" I don't want and can't possibly
take the time to learn. Quark and InDesign took the good stuff from PageMaker
(another early Aldus product) and built a nightmare which demands a crazy
learning curve and constant upgrades. The upgrade path is sorta like heroin,
but heroin is probably more fun.

I used to love my Mac. I couldn't wait to get up and make some discovery... or
maybe even make some art. These days, I turn the damn thing on and spend most
of my time trying to figure out how to run it. It's nearly as awful as a
Windows PC. Making art - right from my heart - is no longer an intuitive
process, let alone an option. I'm no longer an artist... or even a graphic
designer. I'm just a digital ditch-digger, bound to a machine and a corporate
philosophy I'm beginning to hate.

Don't even get me started about the 158 spam messages in my inbox this
morning.

[Wes Rand]

Percival Prim wrote:

> Wes:
>
> What you need is the HandsFree Plugin which enables InDesign to achieve
> everything freehand is capable of plus the extra's your already aware of. In
> the earlier versions i myself possessed a copy of both InDesign and
> Freehand, but in the new version the facility is there for this plugin which
> then nullified my need for Freehand.
> I don't think this discussion is pointing to InDesign as an all-in-one
> solution. Photoshop is in a completely different bracket, along with
> flash...etc. Thats like comparing Dreamweaver to Flash. Two DIFFERENT
> programs! My point is that InDesign can do everything freehand can do (with
> the plugin mentioned) and more and IMHO better!

Well, that's a different kettle of fish. Why didn't you mention that
before? And why can't I find this plugin anywhere? Especially if it
includes everything that Freehand can do inside of InDesign. Why the
tease? Are you marketing this plugin?

[Wes Rand]

Judy Arndt wrote:

> If you're happy doing all your drawing in InDesign, fine. If InDesign has
> specific _drawing_ features that you feel FreeHand lacks, then discuss those
> features. Slamming FreeHand, without giving any details, on a
> Macromedia-provided forum is about as classy as attending a party for the
> sole purpose of insulting the host.

Yes, I'm wondering what's going on with PP. The endorsement of InDesign
was bordering on taunting people who use Freehand. And then, when
questioned, this mysterious plugin -- I can't find a mention of it
anywhere -- is brought up.