How to become a System Administrator?

[New Guy]

Gurus,

I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.

I have worked in school on different flavors, mostly HP-UX but our
teacher never got into deep about any topics. We touched hardware,
network but did mostly shell scripting.

What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?
Should I focus on programming? Performance tuning? Backup and
recovery? High availability?

Please provide me with some pointers. I am very "wet behind the ears"
and appreciate all the help I can get.

Thanks!

ks

[Lew Pitcher]

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New Guy wrote:

| Gurus,
|
| I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
| sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.
|
| I have worked in school on different flavors, mostly HP-UX but our
| teacher never got into deep about any topics. We touched hardware,
| network but did mostly shell scripting.
|
| What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?
| Should I focus on programming? Performance tuning? Backup and
| recovery? High availability?
|
| Please provide me with some pointers. I am very "wet behind the ears"
| and appreciate all the help I can get.

Well, I can't speak directly to the job of System Administrator, but I
can tell you what I've seen SysAdms do...

They program (a little) in languages like C and Java
They program (a bit more) in languages like bash and perl and python
They tune systems for performance
They back up systems, they recover from backups
They add users, change users, delete users, help users figure out things
They generate reports
They configure LANs (from wiring to network software)
They do a lot of things that I haven't enumerated here

Basically, a SysAdm is a jack-of-all-trades. S/He has to be competent at
a wide variety of tasks, and conversant in a wide variety of disciplines.

My advice would be that you get the best 'all round' education you can
get. Don't concentrate on 'tuning' to the exclusion of 'scripting' or
'networking' to the exclusion of 'programming'.

If you can, get a job (part time, volunteer, whatever) where you can
watch real SysAdms at work. 'Apprentice' yourself to them, until you
have an idea of where they spend their time, and what they do.

Now, the /real/ SysAdms here will give you better advice <grin>


- --

Lew Pitcher, IT Consultant, Enterprise Application Architecture
Enterprise Technology Solutions, TD Bank Financial Group

(Opinions expressed here are my own, not my employer's)
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[Tugger]

Lew Pitcher wrote:

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>
> New Guy wrote:
>
> | Gurus,
> |
> | I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
> | sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.
> |
> | I have worked in school on different flavors, mostly HP-UX but our
> | teacher never got into deep about any topics. We touched hardware,
> | network but did mostly shell scripting.
> |
> | What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?
> | Should I focus on programming? Performance tuning? Backup and
> | recovery? High availability?
> |
> | Please provide me with some pointers. I am very "wet behind the ears"
> | and appreciate all the help I can get.
>
> Well, I can't speak directly to the job of System Administrator, but I
> can tell you what I've seen SysAdms do...
>
> They program (a little) in languages like C and Java
> They program (a bit more) in languages like bash and perl and python
> They tune systems for performance
> They back up systems, they recover from backups
> They add users, change users, delete users, help users figure out things
> They generate reports
> They configure LANs (from wiring to network software)
> They do a lot of things that I haven't enumerated here
>
> Basically, a SysAdm is a jack-of-all-trades. S/He has to be competent at
> a wide variety of tasks, and conversant in a wide variety of disciplines.
>
> My advice would be that you get the best 'all round' education you can
> get. Don't concentrate on 'tuning' to the exclusion of 'scripting' or
> 'networking' to the exclusion of 'programming'.
>
> If you can, get a job (part time, volunteer, whatever) where you can
> watch real SysAdms at work. 'Apprentice' yourself to them, until you
> have an idea of where they spend their time, and what they do.
>
> Now, the /real/ SysAdms here will give you better advice <grin>

OK, real SysAdmin here.

Much of the above is good advice. Broad rather than deep is the way to
start, then get deep as you find out what your job requires.

I'd say if I was to pick one topic to get good at, go for Networking.
TCP/IP is all that matters in real world Unix networks - O'Reilly
publish a good book on this subject which I'm willing to bet most
SysAdmins have read at least once.

Good luck!

[Timothy J. Bogart]

New Guy wrote:

> Gurus,
>
> I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
> sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.
>
> I have worked in school on different flavors, mostly HP-UX but our
> teacher never got into deep about any topics. We touched hardware,
> network but did mostly shell scripting.
>
> What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?
> Should I focus on programming? Performance tuning? Backup and
> recovery? High availability?
>
> Please provide me with some pointers. I am very "wet behind the ears"
> and appreciate all the help I can get.
>
> Thanks!
>
> ks

UNIX System Administration, Evi Nemeth et al

[jpd]

In article <2e50789c.0404021210.48086442@posting.google.com >, New Guy wrote:

> I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
> sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.

[snip]

I think you don't know what you're asking for. :-)

> What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?
> Should I focus on programming? Performance tuning? Backup and
> recovery? High availability?

All of those. Add a lot more. Begin with how to make things work. Add,
how to fix things if they break. ObOtherPosters already pointed a few
things out, I'll add a few things more. Just what you see is often not
enough, administrating is rife with hidden reasons, policies, whatnot.

Know where to find and how to read documentation and standards. In the
TCP/IP world of the internet, this means RFC, STD and BCP documents. On
unix this means manpages, handbooks, et cetera. Learn where to find what
you need quickly. Learn to plan ahead, conservatively.

Know how to document what you are doing and to keep track of everything
you do. Administration means paperwork, and administration of computing
means keeping track of all the little and big things you do and all the
little and big things that ``your users'' do and break, and all the
other stuff that just breaks on its own.

People will look at you to _know stuff_, and you can't keep on making
stuff up, so you'll have to know what you're doing. Especially since
sysadmins often get to do ``live surgery''. You want to avoid that, but
you'll get to do it anyway. So you want to know where you are and what
happens if things go wrong and how to mop up with the least bit of fuss
and with the least sleep deprivation on your side.

Learn to back up what you're telling users and your boss(es) with facts
and consequences in a way that they'll still listen to you. Document
why your setup is the way it is. Be prepared for telling people who
want to use it in wild and wacky ways that you never intended, why that
is not a good idea in a way that they won't feel offended.

Learn when to say ``no'', and make sure you are allowed to do that when
you need to.


--
j p d (at) d s b (dot) t u d e l f t (dot) n l .

[Dave Hinz]

On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 16:29:13 -0700, Timothy J. Bogart <tbogart@frii.net> wrote:

> New Guy wrote:

>>
>> Please provide me with some pointers. I am very "wet behind the ears"
>> and appreciate all the help I can get.

>
> UNIX System Administration, Evi Nemeth et al

Be aware that some online sellers are (still!) selling the old edition.
I think it's on third edition now, check the color of the cover. Pretty
sure the current one is the purple one.

Dave Hinz

[Davide Bianchi]

In comp.unix.admin jpd <read_the_sig@do.not.spam.it> wrote:

> I think you don't know what you're asking for. :-)

I think he will quick discover it...

> All of those. Add a lot more. Begin with how to make things work. Add,
> how to fix things if they break.

Add 'explain to someone with an IQ <= 10 that drilling an hole in a
laptop to fasten it to the table with a screw isn't a good way to
prevent it for being stolen'. And NO, I'm not making this stuff up!

> People will look at you to _know stuff_,

And you have to teach them, sometime using a club, sometimes using
an hammer...

I'd suggest you visit alt.sysadmin.recovery for a while.

Davide

--
| Mitchell's Law of Committees: Any simple problem can be made insoluble
| if enough meetings are held to discuss it.
|
|

[Robert Melson]

On Saturday 03 April 2004 11:07, Davide Bianchi wrote:

> In comp.unix.admin jpd <read_the_sig@do.not.spam.it> wrote:

>> I think you don't know what you're asking for. :-)

<snip>

> I'd suggest you visit alt.sysadmin.recovery for a while.
>
> Davide
>
> --
> | Mitchell's Law of Committees: Any simple problem can be made insoluble
> | if enough meetings are held to discuss it.
> |
> |

To the necessary qualities to be a really good SysAdmin, I'd certainly add a
good sense of humor and infinite patience. Technical skills are important,
as everybody who has replied so far has indicated, but you have to have
people skills, as well -- you don't live or work in isolation and have to
interact with those yawps/lusers who infest your user base.

Develop the ability to do "power naps" when you can. Get used to long days
and even longer nights -- the important stuff can _never_ be done during
normal hours or during the regular work week. Get used to the idea that
your "over and above the call" will almost never be recognized in any
substantive way, rarely even with an "attaboy", because it's expected of
you.

Your technical skill set will develop depending on the major flavor of Unix
or other o/s you work with. While there's a core skill set that transfers
from unix to unix, each of the majors has its idiosyncrasies that make it
"different" from the others and .... Concentrate on core skills, worry
about "flavor" when you decide this is what you really want to do,
professionally.

Bob Melson

--
Robert G. Melson A society of sheep must in time beget a
Rio Grande MicroSolutions government of wolves.
El Paso, Texas Bertrand de Jouvenal
melsonr(at)earthlink(dot)net

[Michael Heiming]

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jpd <read_the_sig@do.not.spam.it> wrote:

> In article <2e50789c.0404021210.48086442@posting.google.com >, New Guy wrote:

> > I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
> > sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.

> [snip]

> I think you don't know what you're asking for. :-)

Looks like.
;)

> > What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?
> > Should I focus on programming? Performance tuning? Backup and
> > recovery? High availability?

> All of those. Add a lot more. Begin with how to make things work. Add,
> how to fix things if they break. ObOtherPosters already pointed a few
> things out, I'll add a few things more. Just what you see is often not
> enough, administrating is rife with hidden reasons, policies, whatnot.

Try working out how to setup a system automatically, with all
your enhancements included and patched to the latest update
packages available. The better new systems are prepared, include
quotas if needed, the less work they'll generate in the future.

[..]

> People will look at you to _know stuff_, and you can't keep on making
> stuff up, so you'll have to know what you're doing. Especially since
> sysadmins often get to do ``live surgery''. You want to avoid that, but

LOL...You won't be able to avoid it and be sure that people
expect you to fix things in a minute, they are struggling with
since hours.

[..]

> Learn when to say ``no'', and make sure you are allowed to do that when
> you need to.

Yep, once read a pretty good doc about the job, it pointed out
that this job would need more task switches during a single day,
then most other in a whole year.

- --
Michael Heiming (GPG-Key ID: 0xEDD27B94)

Remove +SIGNS and www. if you expect an answer, sorry for
inconvenience, but I get tons of spam.
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[Erik]

New Guy wrote / skrev:

> Please provide me with some pointers. I am very "wet behind the ears"
> and appreciate all the help I can get.

Here's one URL for you:
[url]http://sageweb.sage.org/[/url]

../Erik

[Doug Freyburger]

Tugger wrote:

>

> > Basically, a SysAdm is a jack-of-all-trades. S/He has to be competent at
> > a wide variety of tasks, and conversant in a wide variety of disciplines.

Not "jack of all trades master of none". SAs need to be "master
of all trades jack of none". Ability to learn a system quickly
and completely to make people think you are this is mandatory.

> Broad rather than deep is the way to
> start, then get deep as you find out what your job requires.

I call this "being a table". Tables are wide and level so items set
on them don't roll around, and they have several legs that reach all
the way down to the floor. An SA needs across the board computer
skills like this (never let the NT folks you happen to know most of
their modules better than they do but be d*mn certain you do). An
SA also needs to be as deep as possible in a few points to hold the
table up. Networking, scripting, modularity and the layers of the
onion, telling users the obvious without ruffling feathers.

[David Douthitt]

"New Guy" <kshop@adnohr.net> wrote in message
news:2e50789c.0404021210.48086442@posting.google.c om...

> Gurus,
>
> I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
> sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.

> What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?

My recommendation is to get certified. I would recommend becoming Solaris
and Red Hat Certified, since those two operating systems comprise the
greatest number of UNIX and Linux installations respectively.

Recommendations given by others are good - infinite patience, programming
skills, and so on.

As for "flavors" don't get stuck on just one - be ready to switch and adapt.
Which variant of UNIX or Linux you wind up administering has more to do with
the corporation than it does with you.

I also recommend getting some UNIX and Linux systems into your house so you
can work on them and learn off-hours - SPARCstation 20s can be had for
$30-50 and can run Solaris 8, Solaris 9, and several Linux variants
(including Debian and Gentoo) and even BSD (including OpenBSD and NetBSD).
SUN Ultra 5s are just a little more and can run the upcoming Solaris 10 and
even more Linux variants.

[Dave Hinz]

On Mon, 5 Apr 2004 09:36:28 -0500, David Douthitt <ddouthitt@cuna.coop> wrote:

>
> "New Guy" <kshop@adnohr.net> wrote in message
> news:2e50789c.0404021210.48086442@posting.google.c om...
>

>> What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?

>
> My recommendation is to get certified. I would recommend becoming Solaris
> and Red Hat Certified, since those two operating systems comprise the
> greatest number of UNIX and Linux installations respectively.

Well, that'll get you past the HR folks, but once you get into the
interview with the techie person, certifications don't mean all that
much. The RHCE is a very complete test, but even still it's more book
learning than it is a test of how good of a sysadmin you'll be.

> Recommendations given by others are good - infinite patience, programming
> skills, and so on.

Yup, that helps.

> As for "flavors" don't get stuck on just one - be ready to switch and adapt.
> Which variant of UNIX or Linux you wind up administering has more to do with
> the corporation than it does with you.

One thing that I like to ask when interviewing someone is what their home
network looks like. A mix of different OS's and system types, all
talking together (be prepared to name details because bluffing would be
astonishingly bad in this case) are a definite plus. "Well, I have a
T1 feed coming in over 802.11b from the neighbor's house, into a linksys
router doing port forwarding to, depending on the service, either the
Linux box, the iMac, the Alpha, the SGI, or one of the Ultra5's. I use
one Ultra5's as a controller for the disk array, and as an nfs/samba
fileserver, while the others are used as application servers, except for
the windows box which is for a couple of games"...that sort of thing.

If you can show that you can get this stuff working nice together at home,
you learn a hell of a lot, and any sysadmin/interviewer that you'd want to
work for is going to understand and recognize the sort of work and learning
that you've put into to get it up and running. Like I said though, make sure
you can back up your claims with specific details when you're asked.

It's a fun and challenging and frustrating and interesting job. It
beats working, but you have to be the right type of person do do it
well and to do it for long.

Dave Hinz

>
> I also recommend getting some UNIX and Linux systems into your house so you
> can work on them and learn off-hours - SPARCstation 20s can be had for
> $30-50 and can run Solaris 8, Solaris 9, and several Linux variants
> (including Debian and Gentoo) and even BSD (including OpenBSD and NetBSD).
> SUN Ultra 5s are just a little more and can run the upcoming Solaris 10 and
> even more Linux variants.
>
>
>

[Tugger]

Dave Hinz wrote:

> One thing that I like to ask when interviewing someone is what their home
> network looks like.

That's a really great interview question I'd never thought of before. I
can see it now:

"Can you describe your home network?"

"Home network?"

"Next!"

[Michael Heiming]

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Dave Hinz <davehinz@spamcop.net> wrote:

> On Mon, 5 Apr 2004 09:36:28 -0500, David Douthitt <ddouthitt@cuna.coop> wrote:

> >
> > "New Guy" <kshop@adnohr.net> wrote in message
> > news:2e50789c.0404021210.48086442@posting.google.c om...
> >

> >> What is the best curriculum that you suggest so I can best prepared?

> >
> > My recommendation is to get certified. I would recommend becoming Solaris
> > and Red Hat Certified, since those two operating systems comprise the
> > greatest number of UNIX and Linux installations respectively.

> Well, that'll get you past the HR folks, but once you get into the
> interview with the techie person, certifications don't mean all that
> much. The RHCE is a very complete test, but even still it's more book
> learning than it is a test of how good of a sysadmin you'll be.

You did take the exam? It' AFAIR about 1 hour multiple choice,
you might be able to learn and then 5-6 hours of real world lab
tests on a system. Most people failed miserable, they didn't have
the required experience.

[..]

--
Michael Heiming - RHCE (GPG-Key ID: 0xEDD27B94)

Remove +SIGNS and www. if you expect an answer, sorry for
inconvenience, but I get tons of spam.
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[Dave Hinz]

On Tue, 6 Apr 2004 14:48:15 +0200, Michael Heiming <michael+USENET@www.heiming.de> wrote:

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>
> Dave Hinz <davehinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>

>> The RHCE is a very complete test, but even still it's more book
>> learning than it is a test of how good of a sysadmin you'll be.

>
> You did take the exam? It' AFAIR about 1 hour multiple choice,
> you might be able to learn and then 5-6 hours of real world lab
> tests on a system.

Unfortunately, my employer at the time felt that the crisis-of-the-week
was more important (to them) than me finishing the class, so I was yanked
out of it to fix something that didn't matter days later, let alone now.
Not annoyed by that though, nope, not me.

> Most people failed miserable, they didn't have the required experience.

Some very experienced folks failed miserable too, 10 years of SunOS/
Solaris doesn't help with redhat-specifics, for instance. I guess
what I'm saying is it's a test that, in order to pass, you have to
be good at learning for and passing tests, but practical knowledge
counts much more.

Dave Hinz

[Sir Chewbury Gubbins]

New Guy <kshop@adnohr.net> wrote:

> Gurus,
>
> I will be finishing college with (hopefully) my bachelor in computer
> sciences in hand. I want to become a Unix system administrator.

No offence intended, but **why**?? There are so many more interesting
things you could be doing....


Choobs

--
Sir Chewbury Gubbins <chewbury.gubbins@nelefa.org>
Knight of the Wholly Gnarly Widget
[url]http://www.nelefa.org[/url]

[Michael Heiming]

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Dave Hinz <davehinz@spamcop.net> wrote:

> On Tue, 6 Apr 2004 14:48:15 +0200, Michael Heiming <michael+USENET@www.heiming.de> wrote:

> > Dave Hinz <davehinz@spamcop.net> wrote:

[..]

> > You did take the exam? It' AFAIR about 1 hour multiple choice,
> > you might be able to learn and then 5-6 hours of real world lab
> > tests on a system.

> Unfortunately, my employer at the time felt that the crisis-of-the-week
> was more important (to them) than me finishing the class, so I was yanked
> out of it to fix something that didn't matter days later, let alone now.
> Not annoyed by that though, nope, not me.

What a pity. If possible you should try to get another
opportunity, I really enjoyed the week.

> > Most people failed miserable, they didn't have the required experience.

> Some very experienced folks failed miserable too, 10 years of SunOS/
> Solaris doesn't help with redhat-specifics, for instance. I guess

There's not much redhat specific knowledge needed, I had never
used RH before the course (4 days + 1day exam). Albeit things
might be complicated, if you are not used to work with multiple
different *nix, including one or another Linux distro.

> what I'm saying is it's a test that, in order to pass, you have to
> be good at learning for and passing tests, but practical knowledge
> counts much more.

Didn't prepared myself or learned before the exam, IMHO any
halfway experienced *nix admin with some Linux knowledge,
preferable on a rpm based distro should be able to pass it.

There's nothing in the exam, which couldn't be told day to day
work for an admin. I agree that the "practical knowledge" is most
important, if one can work out anything straight from a VT, there
should be no problem passing it. Sadly one isn't allowed, due to
several NDA he has to sign, to tell anything specific about the
exam. Even if I don't believe those NDA are worth a straw, since
they were not written in my native language, but then, I won't
test it out.
;)

Regards

--
Michael Heiming - RHCE (GPG-Key ID: 0xEDD27B94)

Remove +SIGNS and www. if you expect an answer, sorry for
inconvenience, but I get tons of spam.
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[Steve Rikli]

Tugger <t459@hotmail.com> wrote:

>Dave Hinz wrote:
>

>> One thing that I like to ask when interviewing someone is what their home
>> network looks like.

>
>That's a really great interview question I'd never thought of before. I
>can see it now:
>
>"Can you describe your home network?"
>
>"Home network?"
>
>"Next!"

Amen, brother.

Another of my favorites:

"Letherman or Gerber?"


Wrt books, others have already mentioned The Bible (Nemeth, et al); for
other reading I've been recommending:

The Practice of System and Network Administration
by Thomas A. Limoncelli (Author), Christine Hogan (Author)
ISBN: 0201702711

This isn't so much of a techie "how to install/configure foo" implementation
sort of book; more on the "why"s and theories and methodologies.

The Unix Guide to Defenestration
by Murph P. Murphy
[url]http://www.winface.com/index.html[/url]

Murph's book is also not really a "how to" book, but doesn't lack for it.

cheers,
sr.
--
|| Steve Rikli ||| They will tell you that you are doing a ||
|| Systems Administrator ||| great job, right up until they walk you ||
|| ||| to the door. ||
|| [email]sr@genyosha.net[/email] ||| - Mike MacDonald ||

[jpd]

On 2004-04-06, Steve Rikli <sr@genyosha.net> wrote:

> Tugger <t459@hotmail.com> wrote:

>>Dave Hinz wrote:
>>

>>> One thing that I like to ask when interviewing someone is what their home
>>> network looks like.

>>
>>That's a really great interview question I'd never thought of before. I
>>can see it now:
>>
>>"Can you describe your home network?"

``One laptop, the rest is in deep storage.''
Well, how do I score? ;-)

> Amen, brother.
>
> Another of my favorites:
>
> "Letherman or Gerber?"

Victorinox. Lost it, and I'm really missing the corkscrew.
Then again, with enough Quality[tm] hotswap autoslide hotplug rackmount
gear around, I get by quite well with two screwdrivers and a label
printer. Did I mention I *like* Quality[tm] rackmount gear?


--
j p d (at) d s b (dot) t u d e l f t (dot) n l .
Missing out on Proper[tm] interviews for fun and profit!