~/Library/ vs ~/System/Library vs /User/Library/

[Doug Brown]

In article <110720031327074895%justin.c@se.net>,
justin <justin.c@se.net> wrote:

> And there is a fourth one in ~/var/root/. I would like to understand in
> which case does a system access or write to a certain Library?

First off, you're a little bit confused. ~ means your home directory. So
the directories are /Library, /System/Library, ~/Library (which is
/Users/username/Library). The fourth one is just root's ~/Library.

> Logical assumption would be that it depends on the current user, but
> for instance some of the preferences or support files are written to a
> ~/Library regardless of which user is currently logged in.

Prefs that are written into /Library generally are supposed to be shared
between all users.

> I also noticed that if I register an app logged in as an user, I have a
> problem running it as a root. This doesn't seem to be a permission
> issue, rather a support files access problem. But then it sort of
> "goes away" and I can't establish any consistent conclusiion why.

I'm not sure why this is. Some installers will ask if you want to be
able to use it by all users, or just the current user. But most
installers don't. :(

> Is there a definite rule which Library acts as the "current" one and
> which acts as a "global" ? And, since some files, plug ins, fonts etc
> can be placed in either Library, which one is preferred and why?

Basically, here's how it goes. Items that are installed in /Library are
accessible by all users. Items installed in ~/Library
(/Users/username/Library) are only accessible to that user.
/System/Library is only for system purposes and should not be modified,
with one exception (the Extensions folder inside of it, which is where
kernel extensions are put).

All three are active at once. But since every different user has their
own ~/Library, only that user's ~/Library is active. Confusing, but do
you sort of understand? :-)

Doug

--
Doug Brown - La Grande, OR
Idiot's Guide to Mac Cases - [url]http://www.ircandy.com/maccases/[/url]
If you want to reply by email, remove "pleasenospam." and ".invalid"

[David J Richardson]

In article <macg3-74D4EC.15325611072003@news.bellatlantic.net>,
Doug Brown <macg3@pleasenospam.mac.com.invalid> wrote:

> > I also noticed that if I register an app logged in as an user, I
> > have a problem running it as a root. This doesn't seem to be a
> > permission issue, rather a support files access problem. But then
> > it sort of "goes away" and I can't establish any consistent
> > conclusiion why.

root is just another user -- albeit a priveleged one on the permissions
front, and with its users folder hidden away. If you want a facility
for it, install to it (in which case the goodies go to
/var/root/Library), or in /Library, where all users can use it.

[subject corrected; placed in order from Apple-installed to
machine-specific to user-specific]

--
David J Richardson -- [email]davidj@richardson.name[/email]
[url]http://davidj.richardson.name/[/url] -- Dr Who articles/interviews/reviews
[url]http://www.boomerang.org.au/[/url] -- Boomerang Association of Australia

[Doug Brown]

In article <davidj-B32408.12353212072003@freenews.iinet.net.au>,
David J Richardson <davidj@richardson.name> wrote:

> In article <macg3-74D4EC.15325611072003@news.bellatlantic.net>,
> Doug Brown <macg3@pleasenospam.mac.com.invalid> wrote:
>

> > > I also noticed that if I register an app logged in as an user, I
> > > have a problem running it as a root. This doesn't seem to be a
> > > permission issue, rather a support files access problem. But then
> > > it sort of "goes away" and I can't establish any consistent
> > > conclusiion why.

>
> root is just another user -- albeit a priveleged one on the permissions
> front, and with its users folder hidden away. If you want a facility
> for it, install to it (in which case the goodies go to
> /var/root/Library), or in /Library, where all users can use it.
>
> [subject corrected; placed in order from Apple-installed to
> machine-specific to user-specific]

Good idea to correct the subject :)

You may want to watch who you're quoting...I didn't say that; the OP
did. :-)

Doug

--
Doug Brown - La Grande, OR
Idiot's Guide to Mac Cases - [url]http://www.ircandy.com/maccases/[/url]
If you want to reply by email, remove "pleasenospam." and ".invalid"

[Simon Slavin]

In article <110720031327074895%justin.c@se.net>,
justin <justin.c@se.net> wrote:

>I also noticed that if I register an app logged in as an user, I have a
>problem running it as a root. [snip]

Don't run applications as root under OS X. It's not designed
for that. There's never a need to enable the root account for
an OS X installation.

>Is there a definite rule which Library acts as the "current" one and
>which acts as a "global" ? And, since some files, plug ins, fonts etc
>can be placed in either Library, which one is preferred and why?

It doesn't quite work like that. Think of it like this: for
any one account, everything from two library directories is
available: the global one and their own one. If you're putting
something on your system and you want everyone to be able to
use it, put it in under the root. If you want only yourself
to have access to it, put it in your home directory.

Now I distinguish between /System/Library and /Library: the
first one is for library routines used by the system: things
that the system itself needs to work. The second is used for
things that applications use -- not essential to keep the OS
working, useful for things that happen once the OS is running.

[Steven Fisher]

Simon Slavin wrote:

> In article <110720031327074895%justin.c@se.net>,
> justin <justin.c@se.net> wrote:
>
>

>>I also noticed that if I register an app logged in as an user, I have a
>>problem running it as a root. [snip]

>
>
> Don't run applications as root under OS X. It's not designed
> for that. There's never a need to enable the root account for
> an OS X installation.

Unfortunately, that isn't really true. If you want to manipulate files
with full root privledges, you either need to learn the command line and
sudo or do it from the Finder by logging in to the GUI as root.
Hopefully, some day Apple will have the ability in the Finder to open a
folder as another user.

[Anno Siegel]

Doug Brown <macg3@pleasenospam.mac.com.invalid> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:

[snip all to get to this:]

> /System/Library is only for system purposes and should not be modified,
> with one exception (the Extensions folder inside of it, which is where
> kernel extensions are put).

Going off on a tangent here...

Unfortunately, parts of the Perl library are also stored in /System/Library.
There are probably good reasons for this, but the consequence is that
Perl modules may want to write there during installation. This, in turn,
means that you have to be root for those installations. Admin privileges
are good enough for most installations, but not for these.

Anno

[Simon Slavin]

In article <fhmQa.425321$3C2.11599257@news3.calgary.shaw.ca >,
Steven Fisher <sdfisher@spamcop.net> wrote:

>Simon Slavin wrote:

>> There's never a need to enable the root account for
>> an OS X installation.

>
>Unfortunately, that isn't really true. If you want to manipulate files
>with full root privledges, you either need to learn the command line and
>sudo or do it from the Finder by logging in to the GUI as root.
>Hopefully, some day Apple will have the ability in the Finder to open a
>folder as another user.

'sudo' is fine. I have no problem with sudo. However, using the
GUI as root is not fine and can lead to problems. For instance,
imagine opening something in /dev in the Finder and having the
Finder try to make a .DS_Store file in it.

[Simon Slavin]

In article <140720030443472700%justin.c@se.net>,
justin <justin.c@se.net> wrote:

>I guess I am seeing the problem from a different angle... Lets put it
>this way: Which Library does an app prioritize to read its preferences
>from, "global" or "user" ?
>
>(For instance, I have BBedit prefs files in all three Libs plus
>registration file in user/Library)

There is no 'prioritize'. Preferences which relate to one user
only belong in the user's folder, preferences which relate to
all users belong in a global folder. For example, suppose you
have an application which comes in 'demo' form and requires
the entry of a serial number to enable all the features. The
serial number should be stored in a global preferences file.
However, if the same application allows different colours for
its windows, the current colour preferences should be stored
in each user's folder.

The application will have to open both preference files to find
out its current settings.

>And - if I am logged in as an user (or root) but applications' files
>were initially stored in /Library during installation - will they
>(preferences) be recreated in the current user (or root) Library?

No. They're for two different things. And if they're preferences
which relate to each user individually then it should never have
stored anything in /Library to start with.

[Simon Slavin]

In article <170720031929080098%justin.c@se.net>,
justin <justin.c@se.net> wrote:

>For one, an application will authorize itself only to a single user,
>the file will end up in the user's preferences folder, not in the
>/Library. Two, a Mac application can not read preferences from two
>files from two diferent libraries, "interpolating" data or whatever you
>are trying to say. It will read from a *single* file with the most
>recent date.

I'm sorry but although you may have a particular application
which behaves as you say, not all applications behave as you
say and that application violates the guidelines Apple
publish about how an application should behave.

It's possible to write applications which behave any way you
please. However, the question you appeared to be asking was
about what the library directories were for, and only Apple
gets to decide that.