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long-duration audio recording? - Mac Applications & Software

Hugh Wolf <lieder.de> wrote:   But you *still* haven't told me what you consider shareware is. The vast majority of programs usually called shareware have restrictions until you pay. Perhaps one should only call a program shareware when its sole restriction is a nag screen. I don't claim to be sure what the difference is, and would be interested in your definition. But more important than the question of whether Audio Hijack should be called shareware or not is your claim, which I strongly disagree with, that "you'll have to be willing to risk buying it without knowing whether or ...

  1. #21

    Default Re: long-duration audio recording?

    Hugh Wolf <lieder.de> wrote:
     

    But you *still* haven't told me what you consider shareware is. The vast
    majority of programs usually called shareware have restrictions until
    you pay. Perhaps one should only call a program shareware when its sole
    restriction is a nag screen. I don't claim to be sure what the
    difference is, and would be interested in your definition.

    But more important than the question of whether Audio Hijack should be
    called shareware or not is your claim, which I strongly disagree with,
    that

    "you'll have to be willing to risk buying it without knowing whether or
    not it will do what you want."

    The restricted amount of time that it will run for at each session
    prevents one using it seriously without paying. But it is certainly long
    enough to see whether one likes its interface, whether it will do the
    job one wants, whether its special features are of use, and so on. I
    downloaded both Audio Hijack and Audio Hijack Pro, played with both for
    a while, and soon concluded that AH was an essential program for me, but
    that the added features of AH Pro were not worthwhile for me.
    --
    Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
    mail to the From address is never read
    Daniel Guest

  2. #22

    Default Re: long-duration audio recording?

    On 2003-10-22, Daniel Cohen <com> wrote: 

    This is what my father used to call a mug's game. I'll pass.

    For the third time: if there's any distinction at all between
    shareware and commercial sofware, and if you can't offer anything that
    distinguishes AudioHijack from commercial software, it CAN"T POSSIBLY
    MATTER what the exact definition is. I'm sorry you can't see this,
    but I'm not a teacher. Somebody else will have to explain it you.

    Only one person (not you) has even attempted to offer a distinction.
    He says the important difference between AudioHijack and, say, BBEdit,
    which nobody calls shareware, is that BBEdit comes in a shrinkwrapped
    box. This feels arbitrary to me, I don't see why the delivery medium
    is relevant. If Bare Bones decided to sell BBEdit only via download,
    would that mean it had moved into the "shareware" category?

    But there's no question that this is a real difference. He understood
    the issue and came up with a rational response. And maybe he's right;
    maybe download-only software really is categorically different from
    sofware that can also be bought in a more physical form.






     

    Take a look at the Subject again. The OP is specifically concerned
    about the ability of the recording software to deal properly with
    recordings of long duration. Explain to me how he can know that about
    AudioHijack in demo mode, when it's designed to degrade after 10
    minutes.

    People's attachment to software they buy is can be quite mind
    boggling.

    Btw I'm a paid-up owner of AudioHijack. It works well for my purposes
    and it seems to be a clean piece of design. But if you point out its
    flaws to me (it has some) I won't throw a hissy fit.



    Hugh Guest

  3. #23

    Default Re: long-duration audio recording?

    Hugh Wolf <lieder.de> wrote:
     
    >
    > This is what my father used to call a mug's game. I'll pass.
    >
    > For the third time: if there's any distinction at all between
    > shareware and commercial sofware, and if you can't offer anything that
    > distinguishes AudioHijack from commercial software, it CAN"T POSSIBLY
    > MATTER what the exact definition is.[/ref]

    This leaves me thinking that *you* consider there is no difference (as
    long as the payware has a demo mode). That's a reasonable enough view,
    if it's what you hold. *You* said that AH was payware and not shareware.
    That's a pointless comment if you think there is no distinction between
    payware with a demo mode and shareware. If you do make a distinction
    between shareware and payware, I would be genuinely interested in what
    you consider it to be, and why you think AH then falls in the payware
    side. Quite simply, your original statement that AH is not shareware
    conveys no meaning at all until you say why you make this claim - if you
    did, I might agree with you, respond that your claim is inaccurate,
    disagree with you but not think it important, or other possibilities. I
    am just trying to understand what you meant by your statement.

    One possible definition of shareware - too restrictive for me, but
    arguable - would be that a program is only shareware if it is fully
    functional except for a nag screen. Another definition might be that it
    depends on the terms of the licence, though I doubt if that distinction
    would be clear enough. Yet another might be that it is a freely
    distributable program whose full functionality is only unlocked by the
    purchase of a registration code - that would certainly exclude demos of
    commercial programs such as Word, Dreamweaver,etc., but there are some
    programs distributed this way that I would class as commercial (Font
    Reserve, for instance). I don't think there is a commonly agreed
    definition, which is why you need to explain the reason you think AH
    sin't shareware.
     
    >
    > Take a look at the Subject again. The OP is specifically concerned
    > about the ability of the recording software to deal properly with
    > recordings of long duration. Explain to me how he can know that about
    > AudioHijack in demo mode, when it's designed to degrade after 10
    > minutes.[/ref]

    OK, I took the word "you" as being generic, not specific to the original
    poster, so what you say makes sense to me. Coupled with your "payware"
    remarks, I thought wrongly that you were being more general about not
    being able to perform any tests before buying.

    I think we are both agreed that a program is not shareware if one cannot
    test it at all before paying.

    But I think he could test two things, which *might* well be enough to
    check, namely

    (1) that AH works ok for a brief time
    (2) that it is possible to split long recordings into several short ones
    (all right, they would be degraded in demo mode, but that would not
    matter as far as checking if the split worked)

    I had one or two problems with AH1 (and, apparently unlike you, did get
    support). Just out of interest, what flaws have you found. I wonder if
    they are ones that would concern me.

    --
    Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
    mail to the From address is never read
    Daniel Guest

  4. #24

    Default Re: long-duration audio recording?

    Hugh Wolf <lieder.de> wrote:
     

    I find distinctions are pretty vague myself.

    It used to be that shareware would run whether you paid or not, and the
    payment was an issue between you and your conscience.

    Myself, if the fee is more than $10 or so and must be paid to use the
    program, then it is commercial. If it is from a "company" rather than
    an individual, even more so.

    Cynic that I am, I suspect much s/w that is in fact commercial is called
    shareware to avoid having to pay MindVision for an installer license.
    ward Guest

  5. #25

    Default Re: long-duration audio recording?

    On 2003-10-23, ward mcfarland <com> wrote: 

    By that definition, AudioHijack is unambiguously commercial, since it
    passes both your tests. (I'm assuming demo-only doesn't count as
    'using the program')

    Is this _the_ definition of "shareware"? No one who understands
    language would ask that question. It's _a_ definition, and if common
    usage is the determining factor, it's at least a plausible one. Lots
    of people seem to use it in roughly this way, though the price
    boundary is far from fixed.

    But rather than pursuing the hopeless task of finding an absolute
    definition on which everyone will agree, a better approach is to start
    where there already is agreement. There's software out there that
    afaik nobody has ever called "shareware", that everyone agrees is
    commercial software. Two examples I can think of are Word and BBEdit.
    I choose these specifically because both are, or have been, available
    as free demo-only downloads, where the demo-only status disappears
    once you pay. The question then becomes, how or why is AudioHijack
    any different? If there are no differences, it would be senseless,
    in the most literal way, to claim that AudioHijack is nonetheless
    "shareware". So far only one difference has been offered: the
    delivery medium.


     
    Hugh Guest

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