Need IMAP Server Selection Advice

[James Stallings II]

Greetings,

I'm a recent covert to FreeBSD from many years of using linux on both
the server and the desktop. I'm currently using FreeBSD 5.3 on the
server and a new variant of FreeBSD called OS/X on the desktop :D

My question involves my server; what is the best strategy to a working
IMAP server? I have my own domain, and have operated IMAP under linux
for years without issue, but I can't seem to get it crankin' under
FreeBSD.

I'm quite certain this has more to do with my relative inexperience
with FreeBSD than with FreeBSD itself.

Whats the shortest path to a working configuration? I'm not particular
about whose software I use; I just need to be able to hit it for mail
via IMAP with Thunderbird or Mozilla.

Thanks in advance!

Best Regards,
Jmaes

--
===================================
Woulds't thou so blame
the fragrant blos'ms wilting
as never to have had her bloom?

[Louis LeBlanc]

On 02/20/05 07:05 PM, James Stallings II sat at the `puter and typed:

> Greetings,
>
> I'm a recent covert to FreeBSD from many years of using linux on both
> the server and the desktop. I'm currently using FreeBSD 5.3 on the
> server and a new variant of FreeBSD called OS/X on the desktop :D

Yup. I'd sure like to get hold of that desktop to play with without
having to buy yet another computer :) Of course, I'll probably get
one anyway one of these days.

> My question involves my server; what is the best strategy to a working
> IMAP server? I have my own domain, and have operated IMAP under linux
> for years without issue, but I can't seem to get it crankin' under
> FreeBSD.

Shouldn't be much difference - except that it might actually be
easier. I came from Linux (way back in the RH6.0 days) running Cyrus
Imapd to FreeBSD running the same. I recently moved over to Courier
Imapd, which I think I like better. Cyrus required a lot of up front
work and detailed tweaking, but Courier was surprisingly easy. The
distribution config was pretty self explanatory with good descriptions
of what was needed, and the only thing I needed to do by hand is make
sure all the maildirs were created - which courier provides a utility
for.

> I'm quite certain this has more to do with my relative inexperience
> with FreeBSD than with FreeBSD itself.

I've always found that it's far easier to get software working when I
use the ports. Nowadays, I never - and I mean NEVER - install
software any other way if there is a port I can use. When I want a
package to solve a particular problem, the ports are the first second,
and last place I search.

> Whats the shortest path to a working configuration? I'm not particular
> about whose software I use; I just need to be able to hit it for mail
> via IMAP with Thunderbird or Mozilla.

You might want to check your disk layout before deciding. Cyrus will
store all mail in a single location, typically somewhere in /var,
while Courier puts it right in maildir folders in the home directory -
although you can tweak this if you don't want to create shell accounts
for every mail account. Personally, I like Courier better. I know
where my mail is, and I have a lot more flexibility in my filtration
and delivery.

Read the other responses coming. There are other IMAP capable servers
in the ports, and most of them will get a nod from the list folk.

> Thanks in advance!

You bet.

Good luck
Lou
--
Louis LeBlanc FreeBSD-at-keyslapper-DOT-net
Fully Funded Hobbyist, KeySlapper Extrordinaire :)
Please send off-list email to: leblanc at keyslapper d.t net
Key fingerprint = C5E7 4762 F071 CE3B ED51 4FB8 AF85 A2FE 80C8 D9A2

Kime's Law for the Reward of Meekness:
Turning the other cheek merely ensures two bruised cheeks.

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[Jeff Hinrichs]

> Shouldn't be much difference - except that it might actually be

> easier. I came from Linux (way back in the RH6.0 days) running Cyrus
> Imapd to FreeBSD running the same. I recently moved over to Courier
> Imapd, which I think I like better. Cyrus required a lot of up front
> work and detailed tweaking, but Courier was surprisingly easy. The
> distribution config was pretty self explanatory with good descriptions
> of what was needed, and the only thing I needed to do by hand is make
> sure all the maildirs were created - which courier provides a utility
> for.
>
>
> I've always found that it's far easier to get software working when I
> use the ports. Nowadays, I never - and I mean NEVER - install
> software any other way if there is a port I can use. When I want a
> package to solve a particular problem, the ports are the first second,
> and last place I search.
>
>
> You might want to check your disk layout before deciding. Cyrus will
> store all mail in a single location, typically somewhere in /var,
> while Courier puts it right in maildir folders in the home directory -
> although you can tweak this if you don't want to create shell accounts
> for every mail account. Personally, I like Courier better. I know
> where my mail is, and I have a lot more flexibility in my filtration
> and delivery.
>
> Read the other responses coming. There are other IMAP capable servers
> in the ports, and most of them will get a nod from the list folk.

I'd have to agree with the poster. For a small installation Courier is
faster to get up and running the Cyrus. But once you start having to
use it with 20-30 users, Cyrus is hands down a better deal. Yes, it
does take a more grokking to get Cyrus running correctly but not having
shell accounts on your mailserver is a blessing.

As long as you have a small installation, most of the decisions are
fairly meaningless, i.e. mbox or maildir, which smtp server, etc.

I had been admin' a moderatly sized (cyrus/exim/spamassasin/clam-av)
setup until recently when we switched to the darkside. (Don't ask, it's
still to painful to think about.)(If you're still curious it had nothing
to do with email capabilities but with scheduling capabilities and the
darkside client)



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[Louis LeBlanc]

On 02/20/05 08:07 PM, Jeff Hinrichs sat at the `puter and typed:

> > Shouldn't be much difference - except that it might actually be
> > easier. I came from Linux (way back in the RH6.0 days) running Cyrus
> > Imapd to FreeBSD running the same. I recently moved over to Courier
> > Imapd, which I think I like better. Cyrus required a lot of up front
> > work and detailed tweaking, but Courier was surprisingly easy. The
> > distribution config was pretty self explanatory with good descriptions
> > of what was needed, and the only thing I needed to do by hand is make
> > sure all the maildirs were created - which courier provides a utility
> > for.
> >
> >
> > I've always found that it's far easier to get software working when I
> > use the ports. Nowadays, I never - and I mean NEVER - install
> > software any other way if there is a port I can use. When I want a
> > package to solve a particular problem, the ports are the first second,
> > and last place I search.
> >
> >
> > You might want to check your disk layout before deciding. Cyrus will
> > store all mail in a single location, typically somewhere in /var,
> > while Courier puts it right in maildir folders in the home directory -
> > although you can tweak this if you don't want to create shell accounts
> > for every mail account. Personally, I like Courier better. I know
> > where my mail is, and I have a lot more flexibility in my filtration
> > and delivery.
> >
> > Read the other responses coming. There are other IMAP capable servers
> > in the ports, and most of them will get a nod from the list folk.

> I'd have to agree with the poster. For a small installation Courier is
> faster to get up and running the Cyrus. But once you start having to
> use it with 20-30 users, Cyrus is hands down a better deal. Yes, it
> does take a more grokking to get Cyrus running correctly but not having
> shell accounts on your mailserver is a blessing.

Exactly. I didn't make this exact point as well as I had intended.
Although, be it known that Courier *does* support mail accounts
without shell accounts. This, of course, drifts back away from the
simplicity that makes Courier so desireable in the first place.

> As long as you have a small installation, most of the decisions are
> fairly meaningless, i.e. mbox or maildir, which smtp server, etc.

Sorta. My understanding is that Courier is strictly maildir, with
some MySQL options I've not really bothered looking at. With a small
installation, this is completely unimportant though.

> I had been admin' a moderatly sized (cyrus/exim/spamassasin/clam-av)
> setup until recently when we switched to the darkside. (Don't ask, it's
> still to painful to think about.)(If you're still curious it had nothing
> to do with email capabilities but with scheduling capabilities and the
> darkside client)

I'm sorry to hear that. I've not had any problem with the few
darkside clients connecting to my server (only 4 accounts, so not a
big deal). Naturally, I forbid the old mickeymouse lookout trojan to
be run on any system under my purvey, so there's just Mom. Up to
recently, she's taken my advice and left it completely alone. Not
entirely sure what she's using it for now - an ISP mail account, I
think. First thing I did when I found out was recommend a
subscription to Symantec's Norton AV.

Lou
--
Louis LeBlanc FreeBSD-at-keyslapper-DOT-net
Fully Funded Hobbyist, KeySlapper Extrordinaire :)
Please send off-list email to: leblanc at keyslapper d.t net
Key fingerprint = C5E7 4762 F071 CE3B ED51 4FB8 AF85 A2FE 80C8 D9A2

Xerox never comes up with anything original.

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[Chad Leigh -- Shire.Net LLC]

On Feb 20, 2005, at 7:07 PM, Jeff Hinrichs wrote:

> I'd have to agree with the poster. For a small installation Courier
> is faster to get up and running the Cyrus. But once you start having
> to use it with 20-30 users, Cyrus is hands down a better deal. Yes,
> it does take a more grokking to get Cyrus running correctly but not
> having shell accounts on your mailserver is a blessing.
>

You don't need shell accounts for courier. Please explain how Cyrus is
easier with 20-30 or more users... Courier conforms to standards,
unlike Cyrus (in terms of mail layout etc) and is easier to tie in to
ant MTA system you want (that can do maildir) and my installation that
supports more than 20-30 accounts works just fine, with no shell
accounts...

best
Chad

[Murray Taylor]

>

> > I had been admin' a moderatly sized (cyrus/exim/spamassasin/clam-av)
> > setup until recently when we switched to the darkside. (Don't ask, it's
> > still to painful to think about.)(If you're still curious it had nothing
> > to do with email capabilities but with scheduling capabilities and the
> > darkside client)

>

This is the _BIG THING_ from managers ....

Even thouogh I had found and trialled 2 - 3 grooupware ports ... the
managers wanted the darkside thing....

The perceived problem with all my previous offerings - they are web
based!

Even though the functionality re calendering, group schedule manegement
(and tons more functions well outside of the darkside capabilities) was
all there... it didnt look like the stuff other execs were using... cant
it sync with my PDA (some can) ... why do I need to go to a web site and
go through that login stuff (ever heard of security? and you gotta do
this in a different fashion with micro$lop anyway)

> I'm sorry to hear that. I've not had any problem with the few
> darkside clients connecting to my server (only 4 accounts, so not a
> big deal).

We also ran 200+ users in several states via WAN on the Cyrus IMAP
server with various MUA's from FreeBSD and the Outlook clients...
With 698 days of uptime too... (had to move the server to a new building
and nobody but me could see the point of moving it still attached to its
UPS... luddites)

> Lou

--
Murray Taylor



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[David J. Weller-Fahy]

* James Stallings II <james.stallings@gmail.com> [2005-02-21 02:06 +0100]:

> Whats the shortest path to a working configuration? I'm not particular
> about whose software I use; I just need to be able to hit it for mail
> via IMAP with Thunderbird or Mozilla.

I'd recommend Binc IMAP. Author is very involved and responsive.
There's a port for it, and here are some links to get you started.

<http://www.bincimap.org>
<http://www.bincimap.org/bincimap-faq.html>
<http://www.lifewithbincimap.org>
<http://www.bincimap.andreas.hanssen.name/archive/?0>

Regards,
--
dave [ please don't CC me ]

[Ean Kingston]

James,

It looks like you got a lot of discussion about your question without getting
a real answer to your question so I would like to try.

On February 20, 2005 08:05 pm, James Stallings II wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> I'm a recent covert to FreeBSD from many years of using linux on both
> the server and the desktop. I'm currently using FreeBSD 5.3 on the
> server and a new variant of FreeBSD called OS/X on the desktop :D
>
> My question involves my server; what is the best strategy to a working
> IMAP server? I have my own domain, and have operated IMAP under linux
> for years without issue, but I can't seem to get it crankin' under
> FreeBSD.

The hands down easiest way to get IMAP up and running on your FreeBSD system
is to install The UW-IMAP server from ports or packages. As root, simply run

pkg_add -r imap-uw

This will install a simple IMAP server that works with the default sendmail
installation. It will work with the clients you mentioned.

If you are planning on running a large mail server (hundreds or thousands of
users) you probably want to go with one of the other ones that were
mentioned. Courier-IMAP is my choice but I understand the Cyrus and Binc are
also quite good.

>
> I'm quite certain this has more to do with my relative inexperience
> with FreeBSD than with FreeBSD itself.

If you are not familiar with the ports and packages system yet, read up on it
in the handbook.

>
> Whats the shortest path to a working configuration? I'm not particular
> about whose software I use; I just need to be able to hit it for mail
> via IMAP with Thunderbird or Mozilla.

IMAP-UW is the easiest. It is not the most robust or feature rich.

>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Best Regards,
> Jmaes

--
Ean Kingston

E-Mail: ean AT hedron DOT org
URL: [url]http://www.hedron.org/[/url]