Old problem

[Gerd_Kalesse@adobeforums.com]

I know, I know, I know …
It's been discussed plenty of times here! But I am just not asking in the right way in my searches!

I have some type that gets fatter In the vicinity of an image that has a transparent area around it. the type is on its own layer, right above everything.

Please help a lost soul. 8-o

Thanks

Gerd

[rob_day@adobeforums.com]

Does it happen when you print to a composite printer or on press with separations? If it's the latter then it's a trapping problem.

Rob

[Gerd_Kalesse@adobeforums.com]

Rob

No seps, on composite printer

Gerd

P.S. Sorry, gotta go. This will have to wait till Monday, but truly appreciate input!

[rob_day@adobeforums.com]

When you print is the Flattener Preset in the Advanced tab set to High Resolution? If you export to PDF do you see it on screen when you zoom in?

[by_Buko@adobeforums.com]

Make sure all type is on top of any items or images with transparency

[rob_day@adobeforums.com]

the type is on its own layer, right above everything.

[Marco_A_SantaMaria@adobeforums.com]

could you send me (us) a pdf of the file to look at the layout and determine if it might be trapping or other problem?
[email]msantama@nuskin.com[/email]

[Gerd_Kalesse@adobeforums.com]

Sorry guys – wild Monday. At long last some time for this problem.

Well … I fell into my own trap. I asked on behalf of a colleague as I am supposed to be the InDesign buff here. I checked the document. I saw the layers, I saw a layer called copy right on top of everything … I'll be darned … every element had been put onto ONE layer only and the copy was NOT on top! 8-o

As soon as I fixed that, no more fattening in the preview nor on the print BUT, I now get a non-existent darkened square area exactly where the transparency "square" sits! It does NOT SHOW on screen in Acrobat. Tried all sorts of printing configs (printing to a Xerox Color Laser), can't make that box go away. 8-o

Gerd

[Gerald_Singelmann@adobeforums.com]

Gerd,
please read this:
<http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx/.3bc12f60/5>

[Marco_A_SantaMaria@adobeforums.com]

Make sure the Simulate Overprint is checked when printing, or exporting

[Gerald_Singelmann@adobeforums.com]

Make sure the Simulate Overprint is checked when printing, or exporting




This actually is one of those reasons that turn text into paths and thereby fatten it. If there are any pixels behind the text.

[Marco_A_SantaMaria@adobeforums.com]

My understanding was that this will only happens if the text was below the transparency. but I might be wrong, I will have to recheck that on my past projects.

[Gerd_Kalesse@adobeforums.com]

Thanks all.

I have read all the relevant stuff.

Document: CMYK
All content: CMYK
Colour management: Consistent
Flattener: Hi_Res
Text: Topmost layer (verified now)

The images sit in angled exact fitting frames with a drop shadow applied.

File prints perfectly from InDesign without overprint simulation turned on. PDF High Quality Print setting (Acrobat 7 – overprint facility greyed out)

Simply can't think of anything else anymore right now.

Gerd

[Marco_A_SantaMaria@adobeforums.com]

could you send me the file or a pdf to check?
[email]msantama@nuskin.com[/email]

[Gerald_Singelmann@adobeforums.com]

My understanding was that this will only happens if the text was below
the transparency.




Text must be converted to paths every time when it gets a fill made of pixels.
This happens basically in two cases:
- there are transparent pixel on top of the text
- the text lies on top of pixels and is transparent itself

When you "simulate overprint" this simulation is done by treating the text as transparent (overprinting black text is in effect similar to text set to multiply)

[Marco_A_SantaMaria@adobeforums.com]

- the text lies on top of pixels and is transparent itself

Gerald,
do you mean the text itself has a transparency?

[Gerald_Singelmann@adobeforums.com]

do you mean the text itself has a transparency?




was that still ambiguous? Let me rephrase my last post.

The transparency-flattener WILL and must convert text to paths every time it in effect gets filled with pixel through transparency effects.

This happens basically in two cases:
- on top of the text-frame lie transparent pixels. That can be a PSD, a feathered object or a drop shadow. In special cases a transparent gradient or an Illustrator file can be the cause, too.
- the text-frame lies on top of some pixel-object and has either some opacity value other than 100% or a blend mode applied.

When you turn on "Simulate overprint" the attribute "Overprint" is treated like a blend mode that is similar but not identical to "Multiply". This is done to pull the CMY values of the underlying pixels into the characters and mix it with the 100% K. This last sentence assumes the text is filled with [black].

[Marco_A_SantaMaria@adobeforums.com]

Gerald, thank you for trying to explain it to me, I might need to read your comments more carefully, Enlgish is not my native Language, and sometimes it is hard to understand for me.
It will take me a while, but it will happen. :)

Gerd,
I have tried to reproduce your problem without any success—don't you hate that, when you know what convinations of element will give you a result but no matter what it doesn't!

So far even placing a frame with a solid color and then adding a 15% Transparency on top of the text will not bold the text below. I do not know if it might have something to do with the lattest update, ID 4.0.4, or the way my setting for inDesign are. I keep looking to see if I can help find a solution to your problem.

[Gerd_Kalesse@adobeforums.com]

Marco

thanx for all the trouble taken.

I know exactly what you feel like when you can't reproduce something that happens to someone else. This current problem is a colleagues anyway and I am always very frustrated trying to find out what was all done and what might have gone wrong. It is quite rare for things to go wrong in my documents as I structure them quite carefully.

I have taught all the necessary processe4s to my colleagues but to get them to apply them is quite another story. So many people just don't want to leave their rust no matter what the advantages would be. Just like the colleague who built a new document onto one I had started and then totally ignored all the layers I had instituted.

Well, it seems, not much of a solution for the PDF problem. I will experiment some more and shall report back if I get some good results.

Gerd

It seems there is quite a big bunch of non native English speakers. My background certainly is not English. B-)

[Graham_Woodcock@adobeforums.com]

The problem is solved by making sure the text box is the topmost layer of ALL the boxes on that layer. If any text layer has drop shadows, or any object has effects or transparencies, then they MUST be below the normal text boxes close by.