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Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9 - Mac Applications & Software

I hear that New Worlds purchased this year cannot boot OS 9.x. So will this make it impossible to partition one with OS 9.x? Some hardware and software that I have requires a real OS 9 to boot into, and not the classic environment which will run most of my apps, except a few....

  1. #1

    Default Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    I hear that New Worlds purchased this year cannot boot OS 9.x. So will this
    make it impossible to partition one with OS 9.x? Some hardware and software
    that I have requires a real OS 9 to boot into, and not the classic environment
    which will run most of my apps, except a few.


    JWolf6589 Guest

  2. #2

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In <20030624201901.18941.00002309mb-m20.aol.com>
    JWolf6589 <jwolf6589aol.comnospam> wrote:
    > I hear that New Worlds purchased this year cannot boot OS 9.x. So will this
    > make it impossible to partition one with OS 9.x? Some hardware and software
    > that I have requires a real OS 9 to boot into, and not the classic environment
    > which will run most of my apps, except a few.
    This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9" means
    "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and run
    your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if you
    like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9.




    J.
    Jennifer Mullen Guest

  3. #3

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    << This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9" means
    "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and run
    your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if you
    like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9. >>


    I cannot understand why they did that. Many new desktop PC's can still but a
    OS below Windows XP.
    JWolf6589 Guest

  4. #4

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In <20030624203948.18941.00002320mb-m20.aol.com>
    JWolf6589 <jwolf6589aol.comnospam> wrote:
    ><< This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9" means
    > "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and run
    > your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if you
    > like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9. >>
    >
    >
    > I cannot understand why they did that. Many new desktop PC's can still but a
    > OS below Windows XP.
    This has been hashed out repeatedly. Please don't try to open up a new
    thread just for whining.



    J.
    Jennifer Mullen Guest

  5. #5

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    > In <1fx3bss.1pirvfj1tim9z2N%andrewnetneurotic.de>
    > Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    > > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    > >
    > >> This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9" means
    > >> "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and run
    > >> your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if
    > >> you like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9.
    > >
    > > How would you install Mac OS 9 on that partition when you cannot boot
    > > Mac OS 9?
    >
    > Use the Classic environment to run the installer?
    >
    Has anybody ever tried this?

    --
    Andrew J. Brehm
    Fan of Woody Allen
    PowerPC User
    Supporter of Pepperoni Pizza
    Andrew J. Brehm Guest

  6. #6

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    Alice Faber <afaberpanix.com> wrote:
    > In article <1fx3bss.1pirvfj1tim9z2N%andrewnetneurotic.de>,
    > [email]andrewnetneurotic.de[/email] (Andrew J. Brehm) wrote:
    >
    > > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    > >
    > > > This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9" means
    > > > "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and run
    > > > your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if
    > > > you like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9.
    > >
    > > How would you install Mac OS 9 on that partition when you cannot boot
    > > Mac OS 9?
    >
    > You don't. That's the point.
    Yes, I know. But I am curious about what Jennifer meant.

    --
    Andrew J. Brehm
    Fan of Woody Allen
    PowerPC User
    Supporter of Pepperoni Pizza
    Andrew J. Brehm Guest

  7. #7

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    JWolf6589 <jwolf6589aol.comnospam> wrote:
    > I hear that New Worlds purchased this year cannot boot OS 9.x.
    Ironically, since you posted this, when Apple announced the new G5
    models, they've also changed the available G4 models, and now all of
    them will boot either OS 9 or OS X. And, as an added bonus, they
    continue to not force you to pay for a floppy disk drive unless you're
    one of the very few Mac users who want one.

    --
    Mike Rosenberg

    <http://www.macconsult.com>
    <http://bogart-tribute.net>
    Mike Rosenberg Guest

  8. #8

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    Tom Stiller <tomstillercomcast.net> wrote:
    > In article <1fx3bss.1pirvfj1tim9z2N%andrewnetneurotic.de>,
    > [email]andrewnetneurotic.de[/email] (Andrew J. Brehm) wrote:
    >
    > > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    > >
    > > > This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9" means
    > > > "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and run
    > > > your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if
    > > > you like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9.
    > >
    > > How would you install Mac OS 9 on that partition when you cannot boot
    > > Mac OS 9?
    >
    > Drag the OS 9 System Folder to the newly created partition?
    Have you tried that?

    You see I have tried all these things. And people in newsgroups keep
    telling me how easy it is and how stupid I am for not figuring it out
    (not addressing you per se).

    But you can neither simply copy the system folder nor run the Mac OS 9
    installer within OS X (unless OS 9 is already installed and you have a
    working Classic environment).

    --
    Andrew J. Brehm
    Fan of Woody Allen
    PowerPC User
    Supporter of Pepperoni Pizza
    Andrew J. Brehm Guest

  9. #9

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In article <1fx490m.m94kess3qet8N%andrewnetneurotic.de>,
    [email]andrewnetneurotic.de[/email] (Andrew J. Brehm) wrote:
    > Tom Stiller <tomstillercomcast.net> wrote:
    >
    > > In article <1fx3bss.1pirvfj1tim9z2N%andrewnetneurotic.de>,
    > > [email]andrewnetneurotic.de[/email] (Andrew J. Brehm) wrote:
    > >
    > > > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > > This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9"
    > > > > means
    > > > > "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and
    > > > > run
    > > > > your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if
    > > > > you like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9.
    > > >
    > > > How would you install Mac OS 9 on that partition when you cannot boot
    > > > Mac OS 9?
    > >
    > > Drag the OS 9 System Folder to the newly created partition?
    >
    > Have you tried that?
    Yes. I dragged a System Folder from an old version 2.1 DiskWarrior CD
    onto an OS X partition which contained no OS 9 system. I then opened
    the newly copied folder, a step that was necesary in the past to update
    the boot blocks. I then selected the newly created system in the
    Startup Disk PerfPanel.

    However, it is necesary for the target device to have the OS 9 drivers
    installed, an option of the Disk Utility formatter.
    >
    > You see I have tried all these things. And people in newsgroups keep
    > telling me how easy it is and how stupid I am for not figuring it out
    > (not addressing you per se).
    >
    > But you can neither simply copy the system folder nor run the Mac OS 9
    > installer within OS X (unless OS 9 is already installed and you have a
    > working Classic environment).
    --
    Tom Stiller

    PGP fingerprint = 5108 DDB2 9761 EDE5 E7E3
    7BDA 71ED 6496 99C0 C7CF
    Tom Stiller Guest

  10. #10

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In article <1fx490m.m94kess3qet8N%andrewnetneurotic.de>,
    Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    >
    >Have you tried that?
    >
    >You see I have tried all these things. And people in newsgroups keep
    >telling me how easy it is and how stupid I am for not figuring it out
    >(not addressing you per se).
    >
    >But you can neither simply copy the system folder nor run the Mac OS 9
    >installer within OS X (unless OS 9 is already installed and you have a
    >working Classic environment).
    Create a .dmg of the OS 9 install CD and run Classic from there.

    Copy the system folder to the partition, and bless it by selecting it
    as the startup disk (if possible) and then re-selecting the OS X
    volume. If that doesn't work, use the bless(1) command line program
    (which has a man page) to bless it.


    --
    Matthew T. Russotto [email]mrussottospeakeasy.net[/email]
    "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit
    of justice is no virtue." But extreme restriction of liberty in pursuit of
    a modi of security is a very expensive vice.
    Matthew Russotto Guest

  11. #11

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    Matthew Russotto <russottograce.speakeasy.net> wrote:
    >
    > Create a .dmg of the OS 9 install CD and run Classic from there.
    >
    > Copy the system folder to the partition, and bless it by selecting it as
    > the startup disk (if possible) and then re-selecting the OS X volume. If
    > that doesn't work, use the bless(1) command line program (which has a man
    > page) to bless it.
    Have you actually tried that?

    Because when Classic starts it wants to modify the system folder which
    means the disk image must be read/write and needs more space than the CD
    partition originally offered.

    And the CD system folder might not work on a disk image that is not a CD
    image.

    --
    Andrew J. Brehm
    Fan of Woody Allen
    PowerPC User
    Supporter of Pepperoni Pizza
    Andrew J. Brehm Guest

  12. #12

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In <1fx3itr.1u2thhkof0mioN%andrewnetneurotic.de>
    Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    > Alice Faber <afaberpanix.com> wrote:
    >
    >> In article <1fx3bss.1pirvfj1tim9z2N%andrewnetneurotic.de>,
    >> [email]andrewnetneurotic.de[/email] (Andrew J. Brehm) wrote:
    >>
    >> > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    >> >
    >> > > This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS 9" means
    >> > > "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot into OS 9 and run
    >> > > your applications. You can create a partition and install OS 9 on it if
    >> > > you like, but you will not be able to use it to boot OS 9.
    >> >
    >> > How would you install Mac OS 9 on that partition when you cannot boot
    >> > Mac OS 9?
    >>
    >> You don't. That's the point.
    >
    > Yes, I know. But I am curious about what Jennifer meant.
    Okay. Let's say our friend partitions a drive and installs OS 9 onto it. He
    can do that (see another branch of this thread), but he can't use that
    partition as a startup volume.

    In much the same vein, I could take a working Windows XP installation and
    clone it onto a partition on my Mac. But my Mac won't use it as a startup
    volume.




    J.
    Jennifer Mullen Guest

  13. #13

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In article <1fx3r2f.18ucqol8ot8w0N%mikePOSTTOGROUP.invalid >,
    [email]mikePOSTTOGROUP.inva[/email]lid (Mike Rosenberg) wrote:
    > JWolf6589 <jwolf6589aol.comnospam> wrote:
    >
    > > I hear that New Worlds purchased this year cannot boot OS 9.x.
    >
    > Ironically, since you posted this, when Apple announced the new G5
    > models, they've also changed the available G4 models, and now all of
    > them will boot either OS 9 or OS X. And, as an added bonus, they
    > continue to not force you to pay for a floppy disk drive unless you're
    > one of the very few Mac users who want one.
    I'm the only one replying to your post, but you cannot boot into OS 9
    with a New World Mac that ships with OSX.

    Floppy disk drive. Oh not that again. Man I own a USB floppy disk
    drive and thats all I need. I do not need to buy a Mac with one
    installed.
    Mac User Guest

  14. #14

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    Mac User <macusernospam.com> wrote:
    > > Ironically, since you posted this, when Apple announced the new G5
    > > models, they've also changed the available G4 models, and now all of
    > > them will boot either OS 9 or OS X. And, as an added bonus, they
    > > continue to not force you to pay for a floppy disk drive unless you're
    > > one of the very few Mac users who want one.
    >
    > I'm the only one replying to your post, but you cannot boot into OS 9
    > with a New World Mac that ships with OSX.
    As of two days ago, when Apple announced the new G5 line, they also
    revamped the G4 line. All G4s Apple sells can now boot into both OS 9
    and OS X. If you don't believe me, check the Apple Store.

    --
    Mike Rosenberg

    <http://www.macconsult.com>
    <http://bogart-tribute.net>
    Mike Rosenberg Guest

  15. #15

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In <1fx4vqv.wda5mt1v4f1ogN%andrewnetneurotic.de>
    Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    >
    >
    >> >
    >> > Yes, I know. But I am curious about what Jennifer meant.
    >>
    >> Okay. Let's say our friend partitions a drive and installs OS 9 onto it. He
    >> can do that (see another branch of this thread), but he can't use that
    >> partition as a startup volume.
    >
    > I am not convinced that the method proposed would actually get it done.
    Which part? That I can't drag an OS 9 system folder onto an empty partition
    and bless it without needing Classic? Or that I can't fire up Classic and
    use it to install OS 9 onto a partition? I'm intrigued by the OS9-on-dmg
    idea.

    I have more than one Macintosh at work that I'd cheerfully format and do
    this with as an experiment. No non-OS9-booting Macs, though (but I'll
    gladly accept one if anybody would like to donate to the cause).




    J.
    Jennifer Mullen Guest

  16. #16

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    > In <1fx4vqv.wda5mt1v4f1ogN%andrewnetneurotic.de>
    > Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    > > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    > >
    > >
    > >> >
    > >> > Yes, I know. But I am curious about what Jennifer meant.
    > >>
    > >> Okay. Let's say our friend partitions a drive and installs OS 9 onto it. He
    > >> can do that (see another branch of this thread), but he can't use that
    > >> partition as a startup volume.
    > >
    > > I am not convinced that the method proposed would actually get it done.
    >
    > Which part? That I can't drag an OS 9 system folder onto an empty partition
    > and bless it without needing Classic? Or that I can't fire up Classic and
    > use it to install OS 9 onto a partition? I'm intrigued by the OS9-on-dmg
    > idea.
    The last time I copied an OS 9 system folder to another place from a CD,
    it wouldn't boot from there and complained about being a CD system
    folder rather than an installed system folder.
    > I have more than one Macintosh at work that I'd cheerfully format and do
    > this with as an experiment. No non-OS9-booting Macs, though (but I'll
    > gladly accept one if anybody would like to donate to the cause).

    It works with an OS 9 system folder that has already been installed.

    --
    Andrew J. Brehm
    Fan of Woody Allen
    PowerPC User
    Supporter of Pepperoni Pizza
    Andrew J. Brehm Guest

  17. #17

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In <cr7jfv88b295nbjmaqpkjhihhooid3nonl4ax.com> foo wrote:
    > On Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:14:21 +0000 (UTC), Roger Johnstone
    > <rojawses.co.nz> wrote:
    >
    >>In <1fx3isy.ulgebscgva5wN%andrewnetneurotic.de> Andrew J. Brehm wrote:
    >>> Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> In <1fx3bss.1pirvfj1tim9z2N%andrewnetneurotic.de>
    >>>> Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    >>>> > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    >>>> >
    >>>> >> This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS
    >>>> >> 9" means "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot
    >>>> >> into OS 9 and run your applications. You can create a partition
    >>>> >> and install OS 9 on it if you like, but you will not be able to
    >>>> >> use it to boot OS 9.
    >>>> >
    >>>> > How would you install Mac OS 9 on that partition when you cannot
    >>>> > boot Mac OS 9?
    >>>>
    >>>> Use the Classic environment to run the installer?
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Has anybody ever tried this?
    >>
    >>It doesn't work. The Mac OS 9 installer is a Classic application. If
    >>you try to run it, the first thing Mac OS X will do is to try and
    >>start Classic, which is required to run any Classic application. If
    >>you don't have Mac OS 9 installed then Classic won't run and you
    >>won't be able to run the Mac OS 9 installer. A bit of a catch 22
    >>situation. Because of this newer Macs have OS 9 on the restore CD i.e.
    >>not the OS installer, but a copy of an installed OS 9 all set up and
    >>ready to go. This can just be copied across to the hard drive. Once
    >>you have OS 9 installed and Classic running, _then_ you can run the
    >>Mac OS 9 installer.
    >
    > Roger, that isn't an issue - all you need to do to get around that is
    > to boot from an OS 9 retail CD - it will run the OS9 installer without
    > your having to install a thing to your hard drive.
    Um, you need to go back and read the first message quoted in this
    posting :-) We're talking about the later Macs which are not supported
    by Mac OS 9, only by OS X i.e. they won't boot from the Mac OS 9 CD.

    --
    Roger Johnstone, Invercargill, New Zealand

    Apple II - FutureCop:LAPD - iMac Game Wizard
    [url]http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~rojaws/[/url]
    __________________________________________________ ______________________
    No Silicon Heaven? Preposterous! Where would all the calculators go?

    Kryten, from the Red Dwarf episode "The Last Day"
    Roger Johnstone Guest

  18. #18

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    On Thu, 26 Jun 2003 09:28:54 +0000 (UTC), Roger Johnstone
    <rojawses.co.nz> wrote:
    >In <cr7jfv88b295nbjmaqpkjhihhooid3nonl4ax.com> foo wrote:
    >> On Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:14:21 +0000 (UTC), Roger Johnstone
    >> <rojawses.co.nz> wrote:
    >>
    >>>In <1fx3isy.ulgebscgva5wN%andrewnetneurotic.de> Andrew J. Brehm wrote:
    >>>> Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> In <1fx3bss.1pirvfj1tim9z2N%andrewnetneurotic.de>
    >>>>> Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    >>>>> > Jennifer Mullen <jsm158+hacksawhacksaw.cac.psu.edu> wrote:
    >>>>> >
    >>>>> >> This was announced quite a long time ago. "Will not boot into OS
    >>>>> >> 9" means "will not boot into OS 9". You will not be able to boot
    >>>>> >> into OS 9 and run your applications. You can create a partition
    >>>>> >> and install OS 9 on it if you like, but you will not be able to
    >>>>> >> use it to boot OS 9.
    >>>>> >
    >>>>> > How would you install Mac OS 9 on that partition when you cannot
    >>>>> > boot Mac OS 9?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Use the Classic environment to run the installer?
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Has anybody ever tried this?
    >>>
    >>>It doesn't work. The Mac OS 9 installer is a Classic application. If
    >>>you try to run it, the first thing Mac OS X will do is to try and
    >>>start Classic, which is required to run any Classic application. If
    >>>you don't have Mac OS 9 installed then Classic won't run and you
    >>>won't be able to run the Mac OS 9 installer. A bit of a catch 22
    >>>situation. Because of this newer Macs have OS 9 on the restore CD i.e.
    >>>not the OS installer, but a copy of an installed OS 9 all set up and
    >>>ready to go. This can just be copied across to the hard drive. Once
    >>>you have OS 9 installed and Classic running, _then_ you can run the
    >>>Mac OS 9 installer.
    >>
    >> Roger, that isn't an issue - all you need to do to get around that is
    >> to boot from an OS 9 retail CD - it will run the OS9 installer without
    >> your having to install a thing to your hard drive.
    >
    >Um, you need to go back and read the first message quoted in this
    >posting :-) We're talking about the later Macs which are not supported
    >by Mac OS 9, only by OS X i.e. they won't boot from the Mac OS 9 CD.
    Eeepp---sorry.
    foo Guest

  19. #19

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    >
    > I believe the error message was something about not being able to start
    > from this system folder unless it is on a CD.
    >
    This message has been included in Installer CDs since 8.x
    The "Boot Anything" system folder on the CD will have been instructed in
    a certain manner by a file written in the CD boot sectors. This is why a
    disk image of the CD -might- work. I Have Not Tried That.

    If the OP has one of those Macs that fell in the unfortunate crack just
    in front of the G5, then he cannot boot from OS9, period.

    The boot rom on the motherboard will not recognise the OS9 startup files
    or MacOS ROM file, and there will be no installer that can write such
    files recognisable by his boot rom.

    If the OP's G4 is not a genuinely 9-unbootable Mac, simply one that came
    with 10.2 pre-installed with Classic in /System/Library/CoreServices,
    then there are methods published around the web.

    If the OP genuinely desires, or needs, to boot OS9 <-> OSX regularly, I
    would strongly recommend creating a separate partition for the OS9
    System Folder and apps. And, referring to the subject line ;-) if the
    partitioning is done in OSX, be sure to tick the box
    [ ] Install Mac OS 9 Disk Drivers
    Peter KERR Guest

  20. #20

    Default Re: Paritioning OSX Mac with OS 9

    In <1fx50uc.1anojjq19u2dxkN%andrewnetneurotic.de>
    Andrew J. Brehm <andrewnetneurotic.de> wrote:
    >> Which part? That I can't drag an OS 9 system folder onto an empty partition
    >> and bless it without needing Classic? Or that I can't fire up Classic and
    >> use it to install OS 9 onto a partition? I'm intrigued by the OS9-on-dmg
    >> idea.
    >
    > The last time I copied an OS 9 system folder to another place from a CD,
    > it wouldn't boot from there and complained about being a CD system
    > folder rather than an installed system folder.
    >
    Right. But it doesn't have to be an OS 9 system folder from a CD.





    J.
    Jennifer Mullen Guest

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