Publisher Website Problems

[analog@logwell.com]

I would like to hear from folks using Publisher for their websites,
especially commercial websites who are dissatisfied. I am in contact
with a law firm pursuing a class action lawsuit over
misrepresentations concerning the use of Publisher for generating
html.

Thanks

Syd H. Levine
[email]analog@logwell.com[/email]

[Don Schmidt]

What is the basis of your complaint? Lack of imagination?


--
Don
--------
Vancouver, USA - One of the great cities in one of the 45+ countries in the
Americas!


<analog@logwell.com> wrote in message
news:19bkb0t1iee2rr365gk3h7ksbqcfd94d86@4ax.com...

> I would like to hear from folks using Publisher for their websites,
> especially commercial websites who are dissatisfied. I am in contact
> with a law firm pursuing a class action lawsuit over
> misrepresentations concerning the use of Publisher for generating
> html.
>
> Thanks
>
> Syd H. Levine
> [email]analog@logwell.com[/email]

[analog@logwell.com]

Yeah, that's it.

Actually, I have coaxed Publisher into doing lots of stuff. But in
the end, it is fundamentally unfit for a purpose it is advertised to
handle. The newer versions produce html that is so bloated as to be
impractical in the real world for anything but a very small website.

Worse yet is persistent representations that it can do web sites well.
Publisher 2002 even included a claim that html is now a "native
language", an outright lie. It cannot even handle the html generated
by its predecessor program. Nor can it truly handle the .pub files
produced in Publisher 2000.

The above is just the tip of the iceberg with respect to problems with
Publisher as a web design program. I fuly expect to be flamed in a
group of Publisher webpage users (of which I am one), but in tuth the
best advice to anyone trying to use Publisher as a website tool is GET
OUT NOW before it winds up costing you a tremendous amount of time
when you finally have to graduate to another program!



On Sun, 30 May 2004 13:41:12 -0700, "Don Schmidt" <Retired
[email]Engineer@PNB.usa[/email]> wrote:

>What is the basis of your complaint? Lack of imagination?

[damzish]

I'm ready to get out! I'll go to MS Frontpage, (unless someone can give me advice on a "better" program) and use publisher for desktop publishing, regretfully I don't have any money now and so I'm stuck. To bad the only person that can save us is David Bartosik, (how do you get any work done saving the world from Publisher's maddness?) Dave, Publisher is incredibly easy to use but but is unforgiving to those of us that have to earn a living instead of trying to solve all the problems that MS codes into their programs, so "lack of imagination" isn't always the issue. Some compasion for us lesser beings, please.

[Brian Kvalheim - [MS MVP]]

In news:2CBE2947-555E-484D-9E49-3D5A501FFE9A@microsoft.com,
damzish <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> posted:

> I'm ready to get out! I'll go to MS Frontpage, (unless someone can
> give me advice on a "better" program) and use publisher for desktop
> publishing, regretfully I don't have any money now and so I'm stuck.
> To bad the only person that can save us is David Bartosik, (how do
> you get any work done saving the world from Publisher's maddness?)
> Dave, Publisher is incredibly easy to use but but is unforgiving to
> those of us that have to earn a living instead of trying to solve all
> the problems that MS codes into their programs, so "lack of
> imagination" isn't always the issue. Some compasion for us lesser
> beings, please.

I recommend you run (not walk) to FrontPage for your web design. Publisher
is perfectly capable of producing fine websites (1-3 page little sites), but
learn FrontPage so you have room to grow.
--
Brian Kvalheim
Microsoft Publisher MVP
[url]http://www.publishermvps.com[/url]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
confers no rights.

[analog@logwell.com]

Show me where M$ admits that anywhere. The retail box still suggests
that Publisher will do it all for a small business. Publisher is not
fit for even a small website, if your standard of fitness is the
generation of even reasonably standard html.

>
>I recommend you run (not walk) to FrontPage for your web design. Publisher
>is perfectly capable of producing fine websites (1-3 page little sites), but
>learn FrontPage so you have room to grow.

[Brian Kvalheim - [MS MVP]]

In news:ncrmb0dbgua9of0gfu61sbpqoahrtbi0t4@4ax.com,
[email]analog@logwell.com[/email] <analog@logwell.com> posted:

> Show me where M$ admits that anywhere. The retail box still suggests
> that Publisher will do it all for a small business. Publisher is not
> fit for even a small website, if your standard of fitness is the
> generation of even reasonably standard html.

>>
>> I recommend you run (not walk) to FrontPage for your web design.
>> Publisher is perfectly capable of producing fine websites (1-3 page
>> little sites), but learn FrontPage so you have room to grow.

MS sells FrontPage along side Publisher in their Office Suite :-). And, yes,
Publisher can (has..and continues to do so) "do it all" for a small
business.
--
Brian Kvalheim
Microsoft Publisher MVP
[url]http://www.publishermvps.com[/url]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
confers no rights.

[analog@logwell.com]

That is a bald faced lie. A small business relying on Publisher to do
it all will soon wind up wasting countless hours fixing the problems
created. That is the essence of my gripe. Do you imagine a small
business will have a one or two page website? Check the IRS
definition of small business before you come back with some silly
retort.

On Mon, 31 May 2004 18:57:47 -0500, "Brian Kvalheim - [MS MVP]"
<publisher@mvps.org> wrote:

>In news:ncrmb0dbgua9of0gfu61sbpqoahrtbi0t4@4ax.com,
>analog@logwell.com <analog@logwell.com> posted:

>> Show me where M$ admits that anywhere. The retail box still suggests
>> that Publisher will do it all for a small business. Publisher is not
>> fit for even a small website, if your standard of fitness is the
>> generation of even reasonably standard html.

>>>
>>> I recommend you run (not walk) to FrontPage for your web design.
>>> Publisher is perfectly capable of producing fine websites (1-3 page
>>> little sites), but learn FrontPage so you have room to grow.

>
>MS sells FrontPage along side Publisher in their Office Suite :-). And, yes,
>Publisher can (has..and continues to do so) "do it all" for a small
>business.

[shannon]

I wouyldnt say it "does it all". it doesnt even have built in frames, and many other things that are uselful and visually appealing to websites. so then soemone says to code it in .. well I thought you could do it all on a WYSWYG program? some it can do.. "ALL" def not!

[analog@logwell.com]

I hate frames. By "does it all", I only mean that I expected to be
able to do a reasonable website. Problem is, subsequent versions of
Publisher cannot do even that. Users are effectively orphaned in
Publisher 2000. That may be passable for the moment, but experience
shows that M$ will eventually abandon it. The present service pack is
likely the last, and there are unresolved bugs past service packs
introduced, among other problems.

On Tue, 1 Jun 2004 02:31:09 -0700, "shannon"
<anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>I wouyldnt say it "does it all". it doesnt even have built in frames, and many other things that are uselful and visually appealing to websites. so then soemone says to code it in .. well I thought you could do it all on a WYSWYG program? some it can do.. "ALL" def not!

[Brian Kvalheim - [MS MVP]]

In news:49onb0l9ff4tfjlq9ddvbome0a6lkmn701@4ax.com,
[email]analog@logwell.com[/email] <analog@logwell.com> posted:

> That is a bald faced lie.

You are entitled to your opinion.
--
Brian Kvalheim
Microsoft Publisher MVP
[url]http://www.publishermvps.com[/url]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
confers no rights.

[JL Paules]

Actually the expression is BOLD-faced lie, not BALD-faced lie.

--
JoAnn Paules
MVP Microsoft [Publisher]



"Brian Kvalheim - [MS MVP]" <publisher@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:eX%234$5BSEHA.3504@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...

> In news:49onb0l9ff4tfjlq9ddvbome0a6lkmn701@4ax.com,
> [email]analog@logwell.com[/email] <analog@logwell.com> posted:

> > That is a bald faced lie.

>
> You are entitled to your opinion.
> --
> Brian Kvalheim
> Microsoft Publisher MVP
> [url]http://www.publishermvps.com[/url]
>
> This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
> confers no rights.
>
>

---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system ([url]http://www.grisoft.com[/url]).
Version: 6.0.693 / Virus Database: 454 - Release Date: 5/31/2004

[Dave Walsh]

One of the other things that I personally found anoying was the lack of support for ASP pages in the software, you can only use html.

[analog@logwell.com]

Bald faced lie is actually correct (usage dating back to circa 1650),
but more recently "bold-faced lie" or even "boldface lie" has become
acceptable usage, but is technically incorrect. What it means is that
an undisguised liar (no beard or mask) is the worst kind. You are not
nearly a learned as you think you are...

On Tue, 1 Jun 2004 17:55:50 -0400, "JL Paules"
<JL_Amerson@hotmail.com> wrote:

>Actually the expression is BOLD-faced lie, not BALD-faced lie.

[Bob - Australia]

Sorry Syd, I reckon you are going to lose your dollars. I have used Pub
since 95 for web pages very well including on line catalogues and numerous
sites that work great including enquiry pages, order pages etc. There sure
is a juggle & a learning curve from version to version however overall, I
can produce a commercial site with several or a hundred pages with ease.
What type or design of site do you want to do?

<analog@logwell.com> wrote in message
news:19bkb0t1iee2rr365gk3h7ksbqcfd94d86@4ax.com...

> I would like to hear from folks using Publisher for their websites,
> especially commercial websites who are dissatisfied. I am in contact
> with a law firm pursuing a class action lawsuit over
> misrepresentations concerning the use of Publisher for generating
> html.
>
> Thanks
>
> Syd H. Levine
> [email]analog@logwell.com[/email]

[analog@logwell.com]

Interesting. Have yopu moved any of these several hundred page sites
into Publisher 2003? If what I read in here is correct, such a site
would comprise HUGE html code. I would be more than happy to move my
site into Publisher 2003. Despite its shortcomings as an html
generator, Publisher is certainly usable for that purpose (except for
the bloated code issue afteer Pub 2K). My primary concern is being
stranded in Publisher 2000. The idea of moving to another program
only arises due to the problems with later versiobns of Publisher. If
you have solved that problem PLEASE expain how. Rhe site at issue is
[url]www.logwell.com[/url] if you want to look at it.


On Wed, 2 Jun 2004 17:19:48 +1000, "Bob - Australia"
<bob@nospam.justmail.biz> wrote:

>Sorry Syd, I reckon you are going to lose your dollars. I have used Pub
>since 95 for web pages very well including on line catalogues and numerous
>sites that work great including enquiry pages, order pages etc. There sure
>is a juggle & a learning curve from version to version however overall, I
>can produce a commercial site with several or a hundred pages with ease.
>What type or design of site do you want to do?
>
><analog@logwell.com> wrote in message
>news:19bkb0t1iee2rr365gk3h7ksbqcfd94d86@4ax.com.. .

>> I would like to hear from folks using Publisher for their websites,
>> especially commercial websites who are dissatisfied. I am in contact
>> with a law firm pursuing a class action lawsuit over
>> misrepresentations concerning the use of Publisher for generating
>> html.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Syd H. Levine
>> [email]analog@logwell.com[/email]

>

[damzish]

I am planning to move on to more dedicated software like Frontpage or Dreamweaver, it's just that it would be nice for Publisher to be more understanding to busy people.

[JL Paules]

It would be nice if *Life* was more understanding to busy people.

--
JoAnn Paules
MVP Microsoft [Publisher]



"damzish" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:0F5E6F6E-0B28-4D7F-A030-F0D0B184A232@microsoft.com...

> I am planning to move on to more dedicated software like Frontpage or

Dreamweaver, it's just that it would be nice for Publisher to be more
understanding to busy people.


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system ([url]http://www.grisoft.com[/url]).
Version: 6.0.699 / Virus Database: 456 - Release Date: 6/4/2004

[analog@logwell.com]

Indeed. But it would also be nice if M$ was a bit more understanding
also.

On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 01:50:06 -0400, "JL Paules"
<JL_Amerson@hotmail.com> wrote:

>It would be nice if *Life* was more understanding to busy people.

[JL Paules]

You know, Syd, by now we ALL know how much you despise Microsoft so why
stick around? I'm not being sarcastic - I'm asking an honest question. There
have been newsgroups that I've enjoyed but when they came a point where I
found myself disagreeing with the posts, I left. My life is too short to
inflict such aggravation on myself. Nor do I expect a company to bend to
make me happy - the only person who can do that is me. And I think I'm doing
a decent enough job on that.

--
JoAnn Paules
MVP Microsoft [Publisher]



<analog@logwell.com> wrote in message
news:l6s6c0dd6q0cro42075rrs80f46khus46h@4ax.com...

> Indeed. But it would also be nice if M$ was a bit more understanding
> also.
>
> On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 01:50:06 -0400, "JL Paules"
> <JL_Amerson@hotmail.com> wrote:
>

> >It would be nice if *Life* was more understanding to busy people.

>

---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system ([url]http://www.grisoft.com[/url]).
Version: 6.0.699 / Virus Database: 456 - Release Date: 6/4/2004