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Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers? - Mac Applications & Software

In article <9a1028df.0306300952.559d9d85posting.google.com >, Martin Farach-Colton <martinfarach-colton.com> wrote: > I have an old laptop running 10.2. I'd like to use it as a print > server, since my HP Officejet g85xi won't talk to my Airport Extreme. > When the laptop is on, everything is great. But if the laptop is > sleeping (which is how I'd like it to spend almost all of its time), > none of my other computers see the printer. They won't. When Macs are asleep they're _asleep_. Ain't nothing going on in those CPUs. Let me describe it this way: It's not supported and ...

  1. #1

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    In article <9a1028df.0306300952.559d9d85posting.google.com >, Martin
    Farach-Colton <martinfarach-colton.com> wrote:
    > I have an old laptop running 10.2. I'd like to use it as a print
    > server, since my HP Officejet g85xi won't talk to my Airport Extreme.
    > When the laptop is on, everything is great. But if the laptop is
    > sleeping (which is how I'd like it to spend almost all of its time),
    > none of my other computers see the printer.
    They won't. When Macs are asleep they're _asleep_. Ain't nothing going
    on in those CPUs.

    Let me describe it this way: It's not supported and no-one better try
    to blame me if they fry a machine trying but in most or all G4 desktops
    you can hot-swap PCI cards while the machine's asleep because it's not
    _actually_ hot.
    > The ideal behaviour would be that my other computers could see the
    > printer, and that the laptop would wake up when I send a print job.
    But they're not going to be able to see it if it's not current present
    and if the machine sharing it is asleep...uh-uh.

    G
    Greg Weston Guest

  2. #2

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 01:10:20 GMT, Greg Weston
    <gwestonREMOVECAPSattbi.com> wrote:
    >In article <9a1028df.0306300952.559d9d85posting.google.com >, Martin
    >Farach-Colton <martinfarach-colton.com> wrote:
    >
    >> I have an old laptop running 10.2. I'd like to use it as a print
    >> server, since my HP Officejet g85xi won't talk to my Airport Extreme.
    >> When the laptop is on, everything is great. But if the laptop is
    >> sleeping (which is how I'd like it to spend almost all of its time),
    >> none of my other computers see the printer.
    >
    >They won't. When Macs are asleep they're _asleep_. Ain't nothing going
    >on in those CPUs.
    Not really - a magic packet can still wake it up, or at least,
    *should* be able to wake it up.
    >Let me describe it this way: It's not supported and no-one better try
    >to blame me if they fry a machine trying but in most or all G4 desktops
    >you can hot-swap PCI cards while the machine's asleep because it's not
    >_actually_ hot.
    >
    >> The ideal behaviour would be that my other computers could see the
    >> printer, and that the laptop would wake up when I send a print job.
    >
    >But they're not going to be able to see it if it's not current present
    >and if the machine sharing it is asleep...uh-uh.
    One could have a virtual printer, and when the packets hit the
    'server', it could wake up. Yes, wayyyy too much work for a server
    (servers should be on, and online) but it's possible...
    foo Guest

  3. #3

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    Martin Farach-Colton <martinfarach-colton.com> wrote:
    > I have an old laptop running 10.2. I'd like to use it as a print
    > server, since my HP Officejet g85xi won't talk to my Airport Extreme.
    > When the laptop is on, everything is great. But if the laptop is
    > sleeping (which is how I'd like it to spend almost all of its time),
    > none of my other computers see the printer.
    >
    > The ideal behaviour would be that my other computers could see the
    > printer, and that the laptop would wake up when I send a print job.
    >
    > The laptop is currently on the network via an Airport Extreme
    > connection, but I can also run ethernet from the Airport if that's
    > going to help wake it up.
    You cannot wake a sleeping Mac with a network packet if its only network
    connection is via AirPort. It requires a wired Ethernet connection.
    Neill Massello Guest

  4. #4

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    Neill Massello <nmasselloearthlink.net> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:
    > Martin Farach-Colton <martinfarach-colton.com> wrote:
    >
    > > I have an old laptop running 10.2. I'd like to use it as a print
    > > server, since my HP Officejet g85xi won't talk to my Airport Extreme.
    > > When the laptop is on, everything is great. But if the laptop is
    > > sleeping (which is how I'd like it to spend almost all of its time),
    > > none of my other computers see the printer.
    > >
    > > The ideal behaviour would be that my other computers could see the
    > > printer, and that the laptop would wake up when I send a print job.
    > >
    > > The laptop is currently on the network via an Airport Extreme
    > > connection, but I can also run ethernet from the Airport if that's
    > > going to help wake it up.
    >
    > You cannot wake a sleeping Mac with a network packet if its only network
    > connection is via AirPort. It requires a wired Ethernet connection.
    Could you elaborate?

    A Mac can be configured to wake up on "network administration access".
    Whatever that is in detail, it doesn't sound as if it depended on the
    connection being wired.

    Anno
    Anno Siegel Guest

  5. #5

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    Matthew Russotto <russottograce.speakeasy.net> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:
    > In article <bdrn6f$rcn$1mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE>,
    > Anno Siegel <anno4000lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de> wrote:
    > >Neill Massello <nmasselloearthlink.net> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:
    > >> You cannot wake a sleeping Mac with a network packet if its only network
    > >> connection is via AirPort. It requires a wired Ethernet connection.
    > >
    > >Could you elaborate?
    > >
    > >A Mac can be configured to wake up on "network administration access".
    > >Whatever that is in detail, it doesn't sound as if it depended on the
    > >connection being wired.
    >
    > It does. Since the AirPort power is turned off when the Mac is
    > asleep, there's no way an AirPort packet can turn the Mac on.
    Well yes, that settles that :)

    A pity, really... So a client can't reliably wake a server over the
    network connection. Power-wise it might make sense to turn only the
    transmitter off, the receiver doesn't (have to) use much power. Then
    the AirPort could keep listening... But that's probably a bit far out.

    Anno

    Anno Siegel Guest

  6. #6

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    wheat <harvest-thismail.utexas.edu> wrote:
    > I cannot get a G4 to wake. Have tried using a broadcast UDP
    > magic-packet, and a specific IP magic-packet, but neither have woken the
    > sleeping machine.
    > This is on a local lan, running 10.2.6.
    Have you tried WakeUp <http://www.coriolis.ch/article18.html>? You need
    to know the sleeping Macs MAC (Ethernet hardware) address, not its IP
    address.

    > I suspect that the NIC has to allow WakeOnLan, and perhaps not all
    > Apple's have such capability?
    I'm pretty sure every G4 does. It's off by default and is not available
    for a PowerBook that is sleeping on battery power.

    > As far as I can tell- the Energy Saver Preference Pane does not have a
    > wake-on-administrative option anymore.
    Do you have an "Options" tab in your Energy Saver preference panel? The
    wake-on-LAN setting is "Wake for network administrator access".
    Neill Massello Guest

  7. #7

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    Anno Siegel <anno4000lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de> wrote:
    > So a client can't reliably wake a server over the network connection.
    Yes it can, so long as the last leg of the network connection to the
    server is by wire. You could connect the server to the LAN port of an
    AirPort Base Station and send a wake packet to it through the base
    station, which never sleeps.
    Neill Massello Guest

  8. #8

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    Neill Massello <nmasselloearthlink.net> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:
    > Anno Siegel <anno4000lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de> wrote:
    >
    > > So a client can't reliably wake a server over the network connection.
    >
    > Yes it can, so long as the last leg of the network connection to the
    > server is by wire. You could connect the server to the LAN port of an
    > AirPort Base Station and send a wake packet to it through the base
    > station, which never sleeps.
    I see. Of course, the LAN port in question serves different purpose now...

    Thanks for the advice.

    Anno
    Anno Siegel Guest

  9. #9

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    Neill Massello wrote:
    > wheat <harvest-thismail.utexas.edu> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>I cannot get a G4 to wake. Have tried using a broadcast UDP
    >>magic-packet, and a specific IP magic-packet, but neither have woken the
    >>sleeping machine.
    >>This is on a local lan, running 10.2.6.
    >
    >
    > Have you tried WakeUp <http://www.coriolis.ch/article18.html>? You need
    > to know the sleeping Macs MAC (Ethernet hardware) address, not its IP
    > address.
    >
    Nope- will do so, thanks. THe others have asked for both the MAC
    address and the IP or broadcast address. One was in javascript and I
    could see that it punts with an error if only one or the other is entered.
    >
    >>I suspect that the NIC has to allow WakeOnLan, and perhaps not all
    >>Apple's have such capability?
    >
    >
    > I'm pretty sure every G4 does. It's off by default and is not available
    > for a PowerBook that is sleeping on battery power.
    >
    >
    This is a tower, one of several- but the only one that is the old, slow,
    400MHz variety- it is the file server, but I want to let it sleep.
    >
    >>As far as I can tell- the Energy Saver Preference Pane does not have a
    >>wake-on-administrative option anymore.
    >
    >
    > Do you have an "Options" tab in your Energy Saver preference panel? The
    > wake-on-LAN setting is "Wake for network administrator access".
    Nope, mine has an Options tab but only has:
    "restart automatically after power failure" with a checkbox...
    Are we taking about Xserver or reg'lar ol' MacOS X?

    cheers.

    wheat Guest

  10. #10

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    In article <bdshbb$gsu$1mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE>,
    Anno Siegel <anno4000lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de> wrote:
    >Matthew Russotto <russottograce.speakeasy.net> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:
    >>
    >> It does. Since the AirPort power is turned off when the Mac is
    >> asleep, there's no way an AirPort packet can turn the Mac on.
    >
    >Well yes, that settles that :)
    >
    >A pity, really... So a client can't reliably wake a server over the
    >network connection.
    It's not a matter of unreliability; it's a matter of simply not being
    able to do it over a wireless connection.
    >Power-wise it might make sense to turn only the
    >transmitter off, the receiver doesn't (have to) use much power. Then
    >the AirPort could keep listening... But that's probably a bit far out.
    Also not possible because the details of the 802.11 protocol.


    --
    Matthew T. Russotto [email]mrussottospeakeasy.net[/email]
    "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit
    of justice is no virtue." But extreme restriction of liberty in pursuit of
    a modi of security is a very expensive vice.
    Matthew Russotto Guest

  11. #11

    Default Re: Sleeping Laptops as Print Servers?

    Matthew Russotto <russottograce.speakeasy.net> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:
    > In article <bdshbb$gsu$1mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE>,
    > Anno Siegel <anno4000lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de> wrote:
    > >Matthew Russotto <russottograce.speakeasy.net> wrote in comp.sys.mac.system:
    > >>
    > >> It does. Since the AirPort power is turned off when the Mac is
    > >> asleep, there's no way an AirPort packet can turn the Mac on.
    > >
    > >Well yes, that settles that :)
    > >
    > >A pity, really... So a client can't reliably wake a server over the
    > >network connection.
    >
    > It's not a matter of unreliability; it's a matter of simply not being
    > able to do it over a wireless connection.
    Well, as Neill Massello has shown elsewhere in this thread, it is (of
    course) possible if the server is connected to the LAN port of the base
    station. The connection may still be wireless.

    You are right to say it isn't a matter of reliability. I should have said
    "unpredictable", from the client's point ov view. It would be nice if we
    could say, if I can see it (a Mac) over TCP/IP, I can also wake it up. As
    it turns out, it depends.
    > >Power-wise it might make sense to turn only the
    > >transmitter off, the receiver doesn't (have to) use much power. Then
    > >the AirPort could keep listening... But that's probably a bit far out.
    >
    > Also not possible because the details of the 802.11 protocol.
    I was afraid there would be protocolary objections against just listening
    in.

    Anno
    Anno Siegel Guest

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