Spacing after inline graphics

[JohnO@adobeforums.com]

I'm working on a bit of a kludge project, one with lots of smallish inline
images. Mostly TIFs, placed inline in a single column per page, and a style
applied to create consistent spacing before and aft.

Page count is a constraint. The images are too big, and the easiest way to
fix them is to scale in ID, 85%. The images get smaller, the text flows up a
bit, they print just right...all good...but the space between the image and
the caption increases after the image is scaled. Or more correctly, the
caption stays put and the image gets smaller, making the distance between
the two more than I want and more than looks good.

This has something to do with scaling the images, no doubt, but what?

-John O

[John Mensinger]

JohnO, have you checked into the leading setting? With everything inline, leading factors into your spacing.

[Dave_Saunders@adobeforums.com]

If those inlines are sitting on the baseline, be sure that you have one of the bottom proxy points selected when you resize them. Or, if you're resizing by dragging a handle do so only by dragging a top handle.

Dave

[JohnO@adobeforums.com]

John: Leading is set to auto. Playing with manual doesn't help.

Dave: I don't know baselines, but digging out my Real World book, when I
view the baseline grid, it doesn't appear to have any relationship to my
doc. Baseline shift is set to 0 in the style. Alighn to baseline is
UNchecked.

I'm selecting the image with the regular selection tool, then transforming
via a right-click and the menu. No dragging. I tried the non-uniform scale,
same result. Hm.

-John O

[Dave_Saunders@adobeforums.com]

John,

All text has baselines. An inline graphic is a "character" so it too has a baseline. When you first import an inline graphic, its frame sits on the baseline of the character containing it.

When you resize an inline frame, it actually does two things:

1. Without changing the baseline of the containing character, it does the resize/rescale that you instruct it to do, using the proxy point you have selected (in the transform palette or the control palette) as the point about which to do the resize.

2. Using the new relationship of the resized/rescaled graphic to the baseline, it now performs a recompose of the text.

So, if you want your inline frame to still be sitting on the baseline after the transformation, you must transform relative to the baseline. Anything else will cause the relationship of the frame's position to the baseline to change -- when you're making the frame smaller, it introduces space between the frame and the baseline. This is the same as grabbing it and dragging it.

Indeed, you can put it back on its baseline by doing that, If you watch carefully, you'll even notice that it snaps to the baseline when you drag.

If your inline frame is in a paragraph by itself (with the return character, of course) this baseline shift is hard to detect except that it introduces some extra space between the graphic and the next paragraph. If I read your topic correctly, this is what you were complaining about.

The baseline grid is a mechanism for forcing baselines on to a design grid. But whether or not you activate that, your text has baselines.

Dave

[JohnO@adobeforums.com]

Thanks Dave, I think I see this now. I can indeed drag the images down to
the baseline, or in my previous words, to the point where the image edge is
even with the bottom of the paragraph mark. Then my spacing is proper. I can
see the advantage of resizing via the pallette now.

Is there a (simple) way to force the images back to 100%, other than
re-placing them?

-John O

[Dave_Saunders@adobeforums.com]

Do you mean just the images or the frame as well?

What I do is this:

1. With the direct select tool, select the image and rescale it, e.g., to 100% (or, relink to a different sized graphic).

2. Run this script to get the frame right:

if (app.documents.length > 0) {
if (app.selection[0] != null) {
myFrame = app.selection[0];
if (myFrame.parent.constructor.name != 'Character') {
myFrame = myFrame.parent;
}
if (myFrame.parent.constructor.name != 'Character') {
alert ('Selection is not an inline frame or graphic');
} else {
if (myFrame.constructor.name != 'Rectangle') {
alert ('Selected inline is of the wrong kind');
} else {
if (myFrame.graphics.length == 0) {
alert ('Selected inline has no contents');
} else {
myGraphic = myFrame.graphics[0];
myBounds = myGraphic.geometricBounds;
myHeight = myBounds[2] - myBounds[0];
myWidth = myBounds[3] - myBounds[1];
myFmBounds = myFrame.geometricBounds;
myFmBounds[0] = myFmBounds[2] - myHeight;
myFmBounds[3] = myFmBounds[1] + myWidth;
myFrame.geometricBounds = myFmBounds;
myFrame.fit(FitOptions.contentToFrame);
}
}
}
}
}

This does make the assumption that I don't want the frame to clip the image.

I use this so much that I have assigned the shortcut Ctrl-I to this script (I'm on a Mac, so the Ctrl key is more convenient for me to use than for you).

Dave

[Anne-Marie_Concepcion@adobeforums.com]

Dave, could you explain that script a bit more. I mean, what does it do and why do you use it so often that you assigned a kbsc to it.

Sounds intriguing but I can't suss it out.

AM

[Dave_Saunders@adobeforums.com]

The script adjust the frame in such a fashion that the baseline of the frame is still sitting on the baseline of the line of text it's on -- assuming that that's where it started.

For example, let's say I have a screen capture as an inline graphic and I want to rescale it. I usually do this in Photoshop (sometimes, I'm even replacing the original graphic with another one). So, I got through these steps:

1. I hold down alt/option and double-click the image.

2. In Photoshop, I change the dpi from (say) 72 to 120, then save and close the file.

3. I reactivate InDesign and the new version of the image is now sitting in the inline frame, but in the top left corner.

You'd think at this point that all I ought to do is choose Fit Frame to Contents from the Object menu.

The writer of the code for that menu item didn't understand the need to adjust inlines from the baseline (or assumed it was not important). Use that facility and the result is a frame that is some distance above the baseline because what it does is collapse the frame (in this case, because we made it smaller) to the current coordinates of the image and then it hands off to the composer.

The composer discovers that the frame is now up there above the baseline and it assumes that if you did that it must be because you wanted to do it, so it recomposes without restoring the frame to the baseline.

So, here's what my script does:

// Make sure there's at least one document

if (app.documents.length > 0) {

// Make sure there's a selection
if (app.selection[0] != null) {

// Make sure it's an inline, allowing for either the image or its frame being the actual selection:
myFrame = app.selection[0];
if (myFrame.parent.constructor.name != 'Character') {
myFrame = myFrame.parent;
}
if (myFrame.parent.constructor.name != 'Character') {
alert ('Selection is not an inline frame or graphic');
} else {

// Make sure it's a rectangular frame
if (myFrame.constructor.name != 'Rectangle') {
alert ('Selected inline is of the wrong kind');
} else {

// Make sure that there actually is a graphic in the frame
if (myFrame.graphics.length == 0) {
alert ('Selected inline has no contents');
} else {

// If we get here, we have live one. Get the geometric bounds of the image (or whatever kind of graphic it might be) and calculate its height and width
myGraphic = myFrame.graphics[0];
myBounds = myGraphic.geometricBounds;
myHeight = myBounds[2] - myBounds[0];
myWidth = myBounds[3] - myBounds[1];

// Now get the current geometric bounds of the frame and set the new values by changing the top y-coordinate and the right-side x-coordinate.
myFmBounds = myFrame.geometricBounds;
myFmBounds[0] = myFmBounds[2] - myHeight;
myFmBounds[3] = myFmBounds[1] + myWidth;

// Set the frame's new geometric bounds
myFrame.geometricBounds = myFmBounds;

// Now the frame is the right size and in the right place, fit content to frame to move the image to where it needs to be to be visible in the new position of the frame.
myFrame.fit(FitOptions.contentToFrame);

// That's all folks!
}
}
}
}
}

I'm not sure that I need to restrict it to rectangular frames only, but so far I've not needed to think about it, so it seemed like a sensible restriction.

Dave

[JohnO@adobeforums.com]

(I'm on a Mac, so the Ctrl key is more convenient for me to use than for
you).

Next to the spacebar and shift, the Ctrl key is the shiniest (most worn down
key on my desktop!

Thanks for your help Dave, I removed an entire spread from my doc just by
fixing this spacing. Your explanation to Anne-Marie makes perfect sense.

-John O

[Dave_Saunders@adobeforums.com]

Of course your Ctrl key is heavily used, just like my Command key. The Control key on the Mac is an extra modifier that is very useful for extra shortcuts. I meant that the key is more convenient for me for custom shortcuts because I don't have to trade for a built-in one.

Dave