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Suggestions for a Lens please - Photography

I am about to use one of my 10Ds in a roll it was never envisaged when I bought it. I need a 200~300 or so lens that can track action ...such as a race car or bird in flight. This is an area I am totally unfamiliar with. If I can get some suggestions it will help me avoid pouring money into that bottomless pit I seem to have put so much in over the last few years. When Minolta introduced the 9000 I saw in their brochure it was (supposed) to be the ants pants at tracking moving ...

  1. #1

    Default Suggestions for a Lens please

    I am about to use one of my 10Ds in a roll it was never envisaged when I
    bought it. I need a 200~300 or so lens that can track action ...such as a
    race car or bird in flight. This is an area I am totally unfamiliar with. If
    I can get some suggestions it will help me avoid pouring money into that
    bottomless pit I seem to have put so much in over the last few years.
    When Minolta introduced the 9000 I saw in their brochure it was (supposed)
    to be the ants pants at tracking moving objects coming towards the camera...
    It wasn't! The Sigma lenses I have on the 10Ds are way too slow at focusing
    to even conside in this roll. So far 4 camera sales people have recommended
    3 different lenses. Should I presume because 2, suggest the same thing that
    this is the one?...

    JT


    auspics Guest

  2. #2

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    In article <GSZSa.7573$OM3.749news-server.bigpond.net.au>, "auspics" says...
    >
    >I am about to use one of my 10Ds in a roll it was never envisaged when I
    >bought it. I need a 200~300 or so lens that can track action ...such as a
    >race car or bird in flight. This is an area I am totally unfamiliar with. If
    >I can get some suggestions it will help me avoid pouring money into that
    >bottomless pit I seem to have put so much in over the last few years.
    >When Minolta introduced the 9000 I saw in their brochure it was (supposed)
    >to be the ants pants at tracking moving objects coming towards the camera...
    >It wasn't! The Sigma lenses I have on the 10Ds are way too slow at focusing
    >to even conside in this roll. So far 4 camera sales people have recommended
    >3 different lenses. Should I presume because 2, suggest the same thing that
    >this is the one?...
    >
    >JT
    >
    >
    I wouldn't go past the 300 f/4 L IS - especially if you are hand holding for
    birds in flight. I use one with a 1.4x tele (I'm still using film), but with the
    1.6x factor, you wouldn't need one. See [url]www.mcfadyen.org[/url] for a few shots taken
    with that combination.

    I have heard in a few places that the 10D isn't the greatest for tracking birds
    in flight, but I can't say from personal experience.

    Andrew Mc Guest

  3. #3

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please


    >
    > Canon 70-200 2.8L USM or Canon 300 2.8L IS USM or if you need it cheaper
    > then Canon 70-200 4L USM or Canon 300 4L USM
    Agreed! :-)


    AU Digital Photo Of The Day Guest

  4. #4

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    I agree also.

    I used the 70-200 f/4 at Eastern Creek a while ago and with AI Servo Mode on
    there were less than 10 out of focus shots from 200, which was pretty good I
    thought.

    -A

    "AU Digital Photo Of The Day" <adpotdpixelpix.com.au> wrote in message
    news:bfhutc$opq$1austar-news.austar.net.au...
    >
    >
    > >
    > > Canon 70-200 2.8L USM or Canon 300 2.8L IS USM or if you need it cheaper
    > > then Canon 70-200 4L USM or Canon 300 4L USM
    >
    > Agreed! :-)
    >
    >

    Admiral Guest

  5. #5

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    In the Nikon world I use the 70-200 with a TC 1.4x - I'm sure the equivalent
    in Canon's would serve you well.


    "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message
    news:GSZSa.7573$OM3.749news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > I am about to use one of my 10Ds in a roll it was never envisaged when I
    > bought it. I need a 200~300 or so lens that can track action ...such as a
    > race car or bird in flight. This is an area I am totally unfamiliar with.
    If
    > I can get some suggestions it will help me avoid pouring money into that
    > bottomless pit I seem to have put so much in over the last few years.
    > When Minolta introduced the 9000 I saw in their brochure it was (supposed)
    > to be the ants pants at tracking moving objects coming towards the
    camera...
    > It wasn't! The Sigma lenses I have on the 10Ds are way too slow at
    focusing
    > to even conside in this roll. So far 4 camera sales people have
    recommended
    > 3 different lenses. Should I presume because 2, suggest the same thing
    that
    > this is the one?...
    >
    > JT
    >
    >

    Gavin Cato Guest

  6. #6

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    The 70-200 2.8L USM is looking like a viable choice along with the 300 f/4 L
    IS as an alternative.
    Has anyone done any comparison between the 70~200 2.8 and the f4.0 model?
    Anyone used the100~400mm f4.5-5.6 L IS USM?

    Thanks to all for your help...
    JT
    --------------------------------
    "Andrew Mc" <andrewnospamplease.com> wrote in message
    news:bfhsqk02gj4drn.newsguy.com...
    > I have heard in a few places that the 10D isn't the greatest for tracking
    birds
    > in flight, but I can't say from personal experience.
    >

    auspics Guest

  7. #7

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    Well, the 10D is apparently better than the D30/D60 in this respect,
    but it still ain't no 1D/V. You may run into limitations of the body,
    depending on what you're doing...

    This isn't something I have experience in, but by reputation, the L
    primes or 70-200/2.8 would be the way to go, I would guess.

    Cheers,

    Danny

    "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message news:<GSZSa.7573$OM3.749news-server.bigpond.net.au>...
    > I am about to use one of my 10Ds in a roll it was never envisaged when I
    > bought it. I need a 200~300 or so lens that can track action ...such as a
    > race car or bird in flight. This is an area I am totally unfamiliar with. If
    > I can get some suggestions it will help me avoid pouring money into that
    > bottomless pit I seem to have put so much in over the last few years.
    > When Minolta introduced the 9000 I saw in their brochure it was (supposed)
    > to be the ants pants at tracking moving objects coming towards the camera...
    > It wasn't! The Sigma lenses I have on the 10Ds are way too slow at focusing
    > to even conside in this roll. So far 4 camera sales people have recommended
    > 3 different lenses. Should I presume because 2, suggest the same thing that
    > this is the one?...
    >
    > JT
    Danny Smith Guest

  8. #8

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    I have an EOS 1v and this too has limitations. Not what you might think but
    for this job they still have limitations. I'm about to do a shoot for an
    existing client. They want digital files. OK, so last time I did work for
    this publisher I used 6x4.5cm trannies.

    The plan now is to avoid entirely the pre-press steps of production. They
    intend to output from their DTP program straight to the printing press. In
    theory at any rate, this will do away with processing the film, scanning to
    digital, chemical proofs, camera ready artwork and all the potential for
    stuff ups that go with it. The bucks they poured into the press might be
    worth it if the samples I saw are an indication.

    Where the challenge for me is, is to provide the digital image files at a
    competitive price to traditional means. I have doubts about the resolution
    capabilities of SLR digitals for this work... Nothing to do with megapixels,
    all about recording detail. So... To capture birds in flight is hard enough.
    Do it with digital and it adds a dimension of difficulty I hope to reduce
    with the right glass. I will still take the 645 in case the whole thing
    backfires.

    Russel's suggestion a few posts up about using a 70-200 2.8 and a
    teleconverter makes good sense to me at this point... We'll see. I think
    I'll locate one and do some testing.
    JT

    "Danny Smith" <dsmithsiroccoresources.com.au> wrote in message
    news:e79d68a5.0307211832.37107458posting.google.c om...
    > Well, the 10D is apparently better than the D30/D60 in this respect,
    > but it still ain't no 1D/V. You may run into limitations of the body,
    > depending on what you're doing...
    >
    > This isn't something I have experience in, but by reputation, the L
    > primes or 70-200/2.8 would be the way to go, I would guess.
    >
    > Cheers,
    >
    > Danny

    auspics Guest

  9. #9

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    One of the guys at the club has some stunning shots of the V8's in
    action at Adelaide, shot on either a 10D or D60, not sure which - I'll
    dig some info out of him if he's there tonight...

    I've also seen some awesome Formula One shots from the 10D, so the
    body SHOULD be able to do what you're after...

    Cheers,
    Stuart

    , On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 22:33:10 GMT, "auspics" <justthe.groups.please>
    wrote:
    >I am about to use one of my 10Ds in a roll it was never envisaged when I
    >bought it. I need a 200~300 or so lens that can track action ...such as a
    >race car or bird in flight. This is an area I am totally unfamiliar with. If
    >I can get some suggestions it will help me avoid pouring money into that
    >bottomless pit I seem to have put so much in over the last few years.
    >When Minolta introduced the 9000 I saw in their brochure it was (supposed)
    >to be the ants pants at tracking moving objects coming towards the camera...
    >It wasn't! The Sigma lenses I have on the 10Ds are way too slow at focusing
    >to even conside in this roll. So far 4 camera sales people have recommended
    >3 different lenses. Should I presume because 2, suggest the same thing that
    >this is the one?...
    >
    >JT
    >
    Stuart Elflett Guest

  10. #10

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    Here's one of the shots I got with that combo:

    [url]http://users.bigpond.net.au/admiral/images/bikesig.jpg[/url]

    -A

    "Admiral" <kbigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    news:fp%Sa.7661$OM3.841news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > I agree also.
    >
    > I used the 70-200 f/4 at Eastern Creek a while ago and with AI Servo Mode
    on
    > there were less than 10 out of focus shots from 200, which was pretty good
    I
    > thought.
    >


    Admiral Guest

  11. #11

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    > Where the challenge for me is, is to provide the digital image files at a
    > competitive price to traditional means. I have doubts about the resolution
    > capabilities of SLR digitals for this work... Nothing to do with
    megapixels,
    > all about recording detail. So... To capture birds in flight is hard
    enough.
    > Do it with digital and it adds a dimension of difficulty I hope to reduce
    > with the right glass. I will still take the 645 in case the whole thing
    > backfires.
    >
    > Russel's suggestion a few posts up about using a 70-200 2.8 and a
    > teleconverter makes good sense to me at this point... We'll see. I think
    > I'll locate one and do some testing.
    > JT

    Digital press equipment is great, but they are not crack hot for really long
    runs... I have output to one here on the Gold Coast many times and the
    results have been good... but I still think a traditional press has the
    edge.

    If you are going to supply press ready images it would be best that "you" do
    the CMYK conversions also... I don't trust anybody at the printers to do a
    decent conversion... you need to apply the correct ICC profiles and undercut
    magenta in the blues and cyans etc ...but that is a whole other topic for
    another thread....

    back to the lenses....

    I have only had my 1.4x about a month and really only used it on a couple of
    days... at this stage the jury is still out, but I think it may slow the AI
    Servo tracking a little... but I need to test some more before I will be
    sure.... I had the V8 Supercars up here on the weekend but could not go...
    that would have been a good test too! ...bummer :-(



    AU Digital Photo Of The Day Guest

  12. #12

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please


    "Stuart Elflett" <stuart(Don'tspamme)dataman.com.au> wrote in message
    news:5vmphv40vn8ptt4tf0pticniub6emb9sik4ax.com...
    > One of the guys at the club has some stunning shots of the V8's in
    > action at Adelaide, shot on either a 10D or D60, not sure which - I'll
    > dig some info out of him if he's there tonight...
    >
    > I've also seen some awesome Formula One shots from the 10D, so the
    > body SHOULD be able to do what you're after...
    Hi Stuart,

    I think it is all a matter of contrast... the 10D does just fine, but if you
    are shooting a low contrast subject that's when things start to go south and
    you wish you had a 1D/1Ds

    Russell


    AU Digital Photo Of The Day Guest

  13. #13

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    Very shallow depth of field there Admiral. Looks like centre spot focus on
    the forearm. Did you compromise the apeture to get shutter speed?
    Was this shot with the lens wide open?
    Can you remember the exposure details?
    Nice enough shot too, incidently.
    Can you tell me how much unsharp mask you gave that pic?
    JT

    "Admiral" <kbigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    news:O16Ta.8039$OM3.5108news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > Here's one of the shots I got with that combo:
    >
    > [url]http://users.bigpond.net.au/admiral/images/bikesig.jpg[/url]
    >
    > -A

    auspics Guest

  14. #14

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    FWIW... I used a 1D for about a month and in my opinion, it is not all that
    much better than the 10D. The resolution is greater but that in itself has
    little value when the side effects are taken into consideration... Like 20
    shots on a 256 meg CFC! As for the contrast thing...

    I, and my 'girls' use digitals to shoot people shots by the hundred. They
    are all low contrast on purpose. The 10D works as well as the SD9 in this
    regard. I find contrast a problem. Maybe the lens flare I've identified
    might impact here but I sure as hell don't like sunny days outside in
    Queensland with a digital of any flavour.
    JT

    "AU Digital Photo Of The Day" <adpotdpixelpix.com.au> wrote in message
    news:bfiv5e$8om$1austar-news.austar.net.au...
    >
    > "Stuart Elflett" <stuart(Don'tspamme)dataman.com.au> wrote in message
    > news:5vmphv40vn8ptt4tf0pticniub6emb9sik4ax.com...
    > > One of the guys at the club has some stunning shots of the V8's in
    > > action at Adelaide, shot on either a 10D or D60, not sure which - I'll
    > > dig some info out of him if he's there tonight...
    > >
    > > I've also seen some awesome Formula One shots from the 10D, so the
    > > body SHOULD be able to do what you're after...
    >
    > Hi Stuart,
    >
    > I think it is all a matter of contrast... the 10D does just fine, but if
    you
    > are shooting a low contrast subject that's when things start to go south
    and
    > you wish you had a 1D/1Ds
    >
    > Russell
    >
    >

    auspics Guest

  15. #15

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    Shallow DOF?

    It was taken at F16, 1/160th. Perhaps the apparent lack of depth is due to
    the panning causing background blur?

    And it probably got a burst of the "Medium" sharpening from Fred Mirandas
    10D sharpening actions that I use, I generally run that on most of my photos
    unless there's a specific reason not to.

    -A

    "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message
    news:NXaTa.8705$OM3.7712news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > Very shallow depth of field there Admiral. Looks like centre spot focus on
    > the forearm. Did you compromise the apeture to get shutter speed?
    > Was this shot with the lens wide open?
    > Can you remember the exposure details?
    > Nice enough shot too, incidently.
    > Can you tell me how much unsharp mask you gave that pic?
    > JT
    >
    > "Admiral" <kbigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    > news:O16Ta.8039$OM3.5108news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > > Here's one of the shots I got with that combo:
    > >
    > > [url]http://users.bigpond.net.au/admiral/images/bikesig.jpg[/url]
    > >
    > > -A
    >
    >

    Admiral Guest

  16. #16

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    OK so presuming the out of focus region on the helmet compared to the crisp
    focus on the arm is in fact motion blur because the helmet is probably
    continually moving in a different place to the arm... The riders boot is
    less clearly focused than the arm. Taking the angle of your shot into
    account I guessed the helmet and boot were roughly in the same distance
    region, I concluded you must have used a wide aperture for them to be less
    clear than the forearm.

    I'd guess that there is less than 100 ~ 200 mm distance between the arm and
    the leg so that would (IMHO) give rise to my conclusion the depth of field
    was shallow. I've never shot pictures like yours but I do know the technical
    consistency publishers demand of their photographs. This (IMHO again) is
    probably the reason why so many "stock" photographs go unsold - small
    technicalities. I still think your photograph is a nice enough shot too,
    Admiral and please don't think I'm criticizing you or your work, just
    commenting on it.
    JT


    "Admiral" <kbigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    news:HpfTa.8866$OM3.6991news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > Shallow DOF?
    >
    > It was taken at F16, 1/160th. Perhaps the apparent lack of depth is due to
    > the panning causing background blur?
    >
    > And it probably got a burst of the "Medium" sharpening from Fred Mirandas
    > 10D sharpening actions that I use, I generally run that on most of my
    photos
    > unless there's a specific reason not to.
    >
    > -A
    >
    > "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message
    > news:NXaTa.8705$OM3.7712news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > > Very shallow depth of field there Admiral. Looks like centre spot focus
    on
    > > the forearm. Did you compromise the apeture to get shutter speed?
    > > Was this shot with the lens wide open?
    > > Can you remember the exposure details?
    > > Nice enough shot too, incidently.
    > > Can you tell me how much unsharp mask you gave that pic?
    > > JT
    > >
    > > "Admiral" <kbigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    > > news:O16Ta.8039$OM3.5108news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > > > Here's one of the shots I got with that combo:
    > > >
    > > > [url]http://users.bigpond.net.au/admiral/images/bikesig.jpg[/url]
    > > >
    > > > -A
    > >
    > >
    >
    >

    auspics Guest

  17. #17

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    No worries mate, I wasn't having a go at you or anything.

    And you're right, the helmet and the back part of the bike do look out of
    focus, and it irks me too. But since it was my first day of motorsports
    photos I wasn't too dissapointed. =0)

    I was finding myself looking for a bit more range though, even with the
    ~300mm effective focal length. That shot is actually cropped a bit to
    improve the composition, but still made for a great A4 sized print.

    -A


    "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message
    news:PniTa.8928$OM3.8290news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > OK so presuming the out of focus region on the helmet compared to the
    crisp
    > focus on the arm is in fact motion blur because the helmet is probably
    > continually moving in a different place to the arm... The riders boot is
    > less clearly focused than the arm. Taking the angle of your shot into
    > account I guessed the helmet and boot were roughly in the same distance
    > region, I concluded you must have used a wide aperture for them to be less
    > clear than the forearm.
    >
    > I'd guess that there is less than 100 ~ 200 mm distance between the arm
    and
    > the leg so that would (IMHO) give rise to my conclusion the depth of field
    > was shallow. I've never shot pictures like yours but I do know the
    technical
    > consistency publishers demand of their photographs. This (IMHO again) is
    > probably the reason why so many "stock" photographs go unsold - small
    > technicalities. I still think your photograph is a nice enough shot too,
    > Admiral and please don't think I'm criticizing you or your work, just
    > commenting on it.
    > JT
    >


    Admiral Guest

  18. #18

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    Can I e-mail you privately Admiral?
    JT

    "Admiral" <kbigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    news:BqkTa.9032$OM3.8085news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > No worries mate, I wasn't having a go at you or anything.
    >
    > And you're right, the helmet and the back part of the bike do look out of
    > focus, and it irks me too. But since it was my first day of motorsports
    > photos I wasn't too dissapointed. =0)
    >
    > I was finding myself looking for a bit more range though, even with the
    > ~300mm effective focal length. That shot is actually cropped a bit to
    > improve the composition, but still made for a great A4 sized print.
    >
    > -A
    >
    >
    > "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message
    > news:PniTa.8928$OM3.8290news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > > OK so presuming the out of focus region on the helmet compared to the
    > crisp
    > > focus on the arm is in fact motion blur because the helmet is probably
    > > continually moving in a different place to the arm... The riders boot is
    > > less clearly focused than the arm. Taking the angle of your shot into
    > > account I guessed the helmet and boot were roughly in the same distance
    > > region, I concluded you must have used a wide aperture for them to be
    less
    > > clear than the forearm.
    > >
    > > I'd guess that there is less than 100 ~ 200 mm distance between the arm
    > and
    > > the leg so that would (IMHO) give rise to my conclusion the depth of
    field
    > > was shallow. I've never shot pictures like yours but I do know the
    > technical
    > > consistency publishers demand of their photographs. This (IMHO again) is
    > > probably the reason why so many "stock" photographs go unsold - small
    > > technicalities. I still think your photograph is a nice enough shot too,
    > > Admiral and please don't think I'm criticizing you or your work, just
    > > commenting on it.
    > > JT
    > >
    >
    >
    >

    auspics Guest

  19. #19

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    There's always challenges with this sort of thing, isn't there.

    The 70-200 and TC will probably be the best option if it's important
    to fill the frame every shot - the 300/2.8 would be a goer if zoom
    isn't as necessary I reckon. Every time I see a full size sample shot
    (well) with this lens my jaw drops!

    Mind you, it'd want to for the price and weight!

    Cheers,

    Danny

    "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message news:<6c2Ta.7817$OM3.286news-server.bigpond.net.au>...
    > I have an EOS 1v and this too has limitations. Not what you might think but
    > for this job they still have limitations. I'm about to do a shoot for an
    > existing client. They want digital files. OK, so last time I did work for
    > this publisher I used 6x4.5cm trannies.
    >
    > The plan now is to avoid entirely the pre-press steps of production. They
    > intend to output from their DTP program straight to the printing press. In
    > theory at any rate, this will do away with processing the film, scanning to
    > digital, chemical proofs, camera ready artwork and all the potential for
    > stuff ups that go with it. The bucks they poured into the press might be
    > worth it if the samples I saw are an indication.
    >
    > Where the challenge for me is, is to provide the digital image files at a
    > competitive price to traditional means. I have doubts about the resolution
    > capabilities of SLR digitals for this work... Nothing to do with megapixels,
    > all about recording detail. So... To capture birds in flight is hard enough.
    > Do it with digital and it adds a dimension of difficulty I hope to reduce
    > with the right glass. I will still take the 645 in case the whole thing
    > backfires.
    >
    > Russel's suggestion a few posts up about using a 70-200 2.8 and a
    > teleconverter makes good sense to me at this point... We'll see. I think
    > I'll locate one and do some testing.
    > JT
    >
    > "Danny Smith" <dsmithsiroccoresources.com.au> wrote in message
    > news:e79d68a5.0307211832.37107458posting.google.c om...
    > > Well, the 10D is apparently better than the D30/D60 in this respect,
    > > but it still ain't no 1D/V. You may run into limitations of the body,
    > > depending on what you're doing...
    > >
    > > This isn't something I have experience in, but by reputation, the L
    > > primes or 70-200/2.8 would be the way to go, I would guess.
    > >
    > > Cheers,
    > >
    > > Danny
    Danny Smith Guest

  20. #20

    Default Re: Suggestions for a Lens please

    Sure thing.

    [email]kbigpond.net.au[/email]

    -A

    "auspics" <justthe.groups.please> wrote in message
    news:Q%lTa.9124$OM3.2131news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > Can I e-mail you privately Admiral?
    > JT
    >


    Admiral Guest

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    By rebecca in forum Photography
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