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SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II - Linux Setup, Configuration & Administration

Am about to install SuSE 9.0 on my secondary machine, but I'm having problems with Boot Manager. At this point these issues are old hat for most everyone, so I'm hoping my questions won't be too hard to answer: 1) box has one SCSI and one IDE drive, and is set to boot from the SCSI first. 2) I'll be trying to install SuSE near the end of the IDE drive Disk 2 Partition Information Name Status Access FS Type MBytes None : Primary FreeSpace 7 None I: Logical FAT 1992 None J: Logical FAT 2000 None K: Logical FAT ...

  1. #1

    Default SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    Am about to install SuSE 9.0 on my secondary machine, but I'm
    having problems with Boot Manager. At this point these issues
    are old hat for most everyone, so I'm hoping my questions won't
    be too hard to answer:

    1) box has one SCSI and one IDE drive, and is set to boot from
    the SCSI first.

    2) I'll be trying to install SuSE near the end of the IDE drive

    Disk 2

    Partition Information
    Name Status Access FS Type MBytes

    None : Primary FreeSpace 7
    None I: Logical FAT 1992
    None J: Logical FAT 2000
    None K: Logical FAT 2000
    None L: Logical FAT 2000
    None M: Logical FAT 2000
    None N: Logical FAT 2000
    None O: Logical FAT 2000
    None P: Logical FAT 3600
    None Q: Logical FAT 250
    None R: Logical FAT 1687


    on P: shown above. (Thanks to Felix Miata for suggesting those
    sizes -- I had hoped to find more notes on VPART at
    http://members.ij.net/mrmazda/partitioningindex.html but there's
    just a link to VPART there.)

    I have the expart fix installed, yet when I started FDISK the
    choice to mark P: as bootable is greyed out (because of mixed
    SCSI and IDE drives?) So, I'm thinking at this point perhaps I
    ought to use a boot loader -- looking through Google I get a
    good sense of VPART, but there's also AIRBOOT. I'm open for
    recommendations.

    I'm used to getting Boot Manager working before installing an OS
    but if I use VPART, say, I guess I'd need to just get Linux set
    up in its partition and then start up VPART (which I understand
    I'd use in conjunction with Boot Manager - that is, VPART would
    offer a choice between SuSE and BM) -- correct?

    Finally, can I install VPART from a hard disk boot of OS/2, or
    do I need to boot from diskette?

    --

    -rafe t.
    www.ray-field.com
    ray Guest

  2. #2

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    Moi,

    Last week I installed an upgrade SuSE 9.0, but did nevertheless a
    complete new install. I can not remember a problem with Boot Manager,
    for I changed some drives: startable and the bigger for '/' , /opt,
    /home and of course a swap partition.
    I have one disk with OS2, eCS, WinNT and SuSE.
    For changing something a 'commit changes' was necessary with LVM (after
    installing).
    A remark: when booting WinNT, it made a mess of the drive numbers, I
    mean 'C' was suddenly 'K' or so. Solved it with its Administator: just
    renaming the proper disks for NT.

    I hope you have new ideas.
    Success
    herman
     

    herman Guest

  3. #3

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 15:25:04 UTC in comp.os.os2.setup.misc,
    com (ray field) wrote:
     

    How about LILO which will be included in SuSE 9.0 I expect. I have it
    installed here and _it_ boots Boot Manager and then I can choose from
    my OS/2's.

    --
    Trevor Hemsley, Brighton, UK.
    pipex.com
    Trevor Guest

  4. #4

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    Trevor Hemsley wrote: 
    Suse uses since long GRUB, it can boot Boot Manager too, and by default
    (if you don't take care) it is installed in the MBR. I clearly prefer to
    have Boot Manager to boot GRUB (which then can again boot Boot Manager
    ;-) and not the other way round. In this case you have to install GRUB
    (or LILO) in the /root partition and not in MBR.

    Klaus Staedtler

    Klaus Guest

  5. #5

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:17:19 UTC in comp.os.os2.setup.misc, Klaus
    Staedtler <net> wrote:
     

    LILO was certainly an option with 8.2 and I suspect that it still will
    be with 9.0 but I don't have a copy to check.

    --
    Trevor Hemsley, Brighton, UK.
    pipex.com
    Trevor Guest

  6. #6

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    Trevor Hemsley wrote: 
    Naturally, as option, but not as default. BTW. during an attempt to
    upgrade my installed suse 8.2 via ftp to 9.0 Grub installed in MBR
    without explicit permission. As the 'upgrade' succeded with an unusable
    linux I cleared the partition completely. (Guess I have installed linux
    since kernel 1.* - don't remember version yet - more often than any
    other OS, maybe I'm too stupid for it, but as long OS/2 serves my needs ;-)

    Klaus Staedtler

    Klaus Guest

  7. #7

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    Klaus Staedtler wrote:
     
     [/ref]
     

    GRUB is the default in all versions of SuSE I have installed: 8.0, 8.1,
    8.2 & 9.0. Trevor's been using SuSE since way back when, prolly before
    GRUB was born.
     

    What I do. :-)
     

    It should be installed in /boot, which may or may not be a part of /. I
    always create a separate little /boot in /dev/Xda5 and put GRUB there to
    boot however many distros I have installed to various / partitions.
    --
    "The object and practice of liberty lies in the limitation of
    governmental power." General Douglas MacArthur

    Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

    Felix Miata *** http://members.ij.net/mrmazda/partitioningindex.html


    -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
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    Felix Guest

  8. #8

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    Wed, 14 Jan 2004 15:25:04 UTC, com (ray field)
    Noted:
     
     
     
     

    Try installing Vpart in the MBR. Use it to pass control to Bootmanager
    for when it's needed. See...

    http://rsgibson.com/os2linux.htm

    That's way more info than you need. Just stick Vpart in the MBR, add Linux
    and
    Bootmanager and that's it. I'm sure there are other solutions but this has
    the
    advantage of being robust yet easy to maintain and install.
    Ron Guest

  9. #9

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 15:25:04 UTC, com (ray field) wrote:
     
    [...]

    The problem here is that the EXPART version of BootManager will not
    boot a logical partition on a secondary drive. Primary or logical
    on Drive 0 and Primary on Drive 1 all work OK.

    I got a new disk last year and tried to make it Drive 1 with all
    logicals while retaining my old disk as Drive 0 with two primaries
    for Dos & Win. When that didn't work, I ed around for days
    on end trying different combinations. Eventually I gave up, ditched
    the old drive, and copied the M$ stuff to a couple of primaries on
    the new one.

    BTW... I just installed Suse 9.0 Pro last week - it was the slickest,
    most trouble-free install I've ever encountered. Of course, spending
    several hours reading the 2 manuals didn't hurt (wow! hard-copy!!).
    This contrasts markedly with my failed attempt to install a ..um..
    "demonstration" copy of XP the week before. eCS v1.1 should arrive
    next week, so I look forward to seeing how it stacks up.

    I installed GRUB in the boot record of my boot partition (a logical)
    and pointed BM at it - works great. If you want to keep BM as your
    primary boot manager, you could probably install GRUB in the unused
    primary on Disk 1, then point it at the desired partition. You can
    use LVM to hide this primary from OS/2 but I don't know how M$
    products will react to its presence. Here's a perverse thought:
    if this primary is for GRUB only, you might try making it a hidden
    FAT-16 partition (type 0x16) which should render it invisible to
    Dos, Win, and OS/2.


    --
    == == almost usable email address: DragText AT E-vertise.Com == ==
    __________________________________________________ _________________

    | DragText v3.8
    Rich Walsh | A Distinctly Different Desktop Enhancement
    Ft Myers, FL | http://e-vertise.com/dragtext/
    __________________________________________________ _________________

    Rich Guest

  10. #10

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    In article <40056cc2$0$137$nntp.hccnet.nl>,
    herman Kaemingk <nl> wrote: 

    thanks for the notes, Herman. I think probably Rich Walsh
    has diagnosed the problem. it's probably not the place but
    I'd be interested in how you use SuSE -- can't imagine I'll
    be doing anything more than playing with it at least for a
    few months but we'll see.

    --

    -rafe t.
    www.ray-field.com
    ray Guest

  11. #11

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    In article <dsl.pipex.com>,
    "Trevor Hemsley" <spam.dial.pipex.com> wrote: 
    >
    >How about LILO which will be included in SuSE 9.0 I expect. I have it
    >installed here and _it_ boots Boot Manager and then I can choose from
    >my OS/2's.
    >
    >--
    >Trevor Hemsley, Brighton, UK.
    >pipex.com[/ref]


    thanks, as ever, for the suggestion, Trevor. I have a
    feeling I'm going to go with VPART but then again, after
    I've ed up something in two or three days and my MBR is
    in shreds and I can't boot anything but the BIOS setup
    screen, I might try it out. or at least wish I had!

    «MDNM»--

    -rafe t.
    www.ray-field.com

    ray Guest

  12. #12

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    In article <dialsprint.net>,
    "Rich Walsh" <0.0.1> wrote:
    .....

    250 
    >[...]
    >
    >The problem here is that the EXPART version of BootManager will not
    >boot a logical partition on a secondary drive. Primary or logical
    >on Drive 0 and Primary on Drive 1 all work OK.[/ref]

    thanks for the informed observations. (it's a bit painful
    to see BM crippled by IBM's maintenance mode.) I had
    thought it was something like that.

    I even wondered whether trying to install "another" Boot
    Manager in the unused primary just to see if that might do
    the trick -- I remember once unplugging a second SCSI HD,
    and turned on the computer in order to transfer several
    partitions to a new HD -- and finding to my astonishment
    that there was a "shadow" BM occupying that first partition
    -- at least I think that's what happened, because I don't
    remember putting BM on that disk, and yet there it was when
    I booted up. doesn't make sense, so maybe I'm making
    something up.
     

    before I got the SuSE 9.0 installation CDs I downloaded
    enough from the SuSE site to get the diskette boot disks
    ready. I was quite impressed with how well the sniffing
    programs worked.

    I am an utter newbie as far as Linux is concerned. I have
    been looking through a few books to get myself familiar with
    bash, the various editors, etc -- it's quite daunting, but
    extremely powerful -- but more than anything else, exudes a
    fatal potential for a decade or so of futzing. it's a
    little weird to be caught between perfection, virtually
    achieved and left for dead, and limitless potential. more
    to the point, I suspect that DOSEMU isn't really ready
    for me (especially since the vaunted "Dosemu for Dummies")
    page hasn't had its promised update in like, three months).
     

    hmm, that's an intriguing thought, except I'm at Warp 4 FP
    15 so I haven't got LVM. I suspect that the W98 partition
    might just start switching drive letters around, which
    wouldn't be a terrible thing but probably something I'd as
    soon avoid.
     

    generally speaking, I'm all in favor of perversion, but I
    think that particular one is a little ambitious for me.
    think I'm going to do a wee bit more homework and see about
    VPART.

    thanks, Rich,

    rafe t.
     

    ray Guest

  13. #13

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    In article <eleS4DQ3N6dS-pn2-Brz4L6oXH8sjlocalhost>,
    com (Ron Gibson) wrote: 



    >
    >Try installing Vpart in the MBR. Use it to pass control to Bootmanager
    >for when it's needed. See...
    >
    >http://rsgibson.com/os2linux.htm[/ref]

    big thanks for this -- just the reassurance I needed.
    as a matter of fact it was your original experience with
    VPART that Googled me into the notion to begin with. might
    give it a try over the weekend.

    -rafe t.

     

    ray Guest

  14. #14

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    Thu, 15 Jan 2004 22:35:44 UTC, com (ray field)
    Noted:
     [/ref]
     [/ref]
     

    Recovery is easy also. Sometimes something will nuke it out of the MBR
    like playing with DOS or Linux fdisk.

    No problem. You can put it all on one DOS boot floppy and run it off
    of a floppy. Suppose you lose both Bootmanager and Vpart at the same
    time. It's faster to install Vpart than to boot 3-4 OS/2 disks to
    reinstall BM. Just add OS/2 to the menu, boot it up and then reinstall
    BM.

    Case 2 - Forgot to make that boot floppy but Vpart files (not the boot
    manager but the install files) are unzipped on drive D, in a directory
    named vpart.

    Solution - get a DOS boot disk and get to a prompt. Issue...

    d:\vpart\vpartdos <enter>

    And you can proceed to reinstall.

    I have Linux and *could* use Lilo, but this is much easier and faster,
    IMO (by adding BM to the Lilo menu).

    I've been using this about 2 years now.

    Ron Guest

  15. #15

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    In <40056cc2$0$137$nntp.hccnet.nl>, on 01/14/2004
    at 05:22 PM, herman Kaemingk <nl>
    said:
     

    I haven't either, but he has a mixture of IDE and SCSI, which is
    something I've never tried, unless you count an IDE CD-ROM drive on
    the SCSI machine. I was a bit nervous about LVM, but it didn't cause
    any problems; I suspect that all of the reported glitches were due to
    VCU, which eCS 1.1 doesn't use.

    --
    Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT

    Unsolicited bulk E-mail will be subject to legal action. I reserve
    the right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail.

    Reply to domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+news to contact me. Do
    not reply to lspace.org

    Shmuel Guest

  16. #16

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    In <PIfNb.126679$chello.at>, on 01/14/2004
    at 06:17 PM, Klaus Staedtler <net> said:
     

    Easy to override, and easy to undo. The one that I object[1] to is PQ
    PM, which changes partition types with no notice.
     

    OTOH, BM can handle only 4 systems.

    [1] Since I own a copy of GTU, I was able to put it back. I wasn't a
    happy camper, but it was just a nuisance. It would have been far
    worse for someone without a sector editor.

    --
    Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT

    Unsolicited bulk E-mail will be subject to legal action. I reserve
    the right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail.

    Reply to domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+news to contact me. Do
    not reply to lspace.org

    Shmuel Guest

  17. #17

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    In
    <dialsprint.net>,
    on 01/15/2004
    at 08:05 AM, "Rich Walsh" <0.0.1> said:
     

    I found both eCS1.1 and SUSE to be easy installs, modulo some driver
    issues for my ELSA WINNER 2000PRO/X-2 and an old BIOS.
     

    Why would you want either / or /boot to be a primary partition instead
    of a logical drive? The only reaons that I can think of for a primary
    partition are:

    1. You want to boot directly to it.

    2. It has a system that won't work on a logical.

    --
    Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT

    Unsolicited bulk E-mail will be subject to legal action. I reserve
    the right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail.

    Reply to domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+news to contact me. Do
    not reply to lspace.org

    Shmuel Guest

  18. #18

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 22:26:23 UTC, com (ray field) wrote:
     
    >
    > before I got the SuSE 9.0 installation CDs I downloaded
    > enough from the SuSE site to get the diskette boot disks
    > ready. I was quite impressed with how well the sniffing
    > programs worked.
    >
    > I am an utter newbie as far as Linux is concerned. I have
    > been looking through a few books to get myself familiar with
    > bash, the various editors, etc -- it's quite daunting, but
    > extremely powerful -- but more than anything else, exudes a
    > fatal potential for a decade or so of futzing. it's a
    > little weird to be caught between perfection, virtually
    > achieved and left for dead, and limitless potential. more
    > to the point, I suspect that DOSEMU isn't really ready
    > for me (especially since the vaunted "Dosemu for Dummies")
    > page hasn't had its promised update in like, three months).[/ref]

    You may be disappointed. Suse, with its KDE desktop & YaST setup
    util, makes Windows look positively forthcoming in providing direct
    access to your settings. I setup my modem & ISP info, then later
    realized I'd entered the wrong phone nbr and left some stuff out
    of the modem init string. Try as I might, I couldn't find any
    GUI way of changing these and none of the GUI stuff would admit
    where they'd stashed this info. I finally logged in as root and
    did a text search to locate the files containing these strings.

    On the whole, I'm offended by the more-Windows-than-Windows UI
    and can hardly wait to get more familiar with the system so I can
    get rid of this stuff. Where's the challenge? :-) I suppose if
    I had any real _use_ for a computer (other than to write computer
    programs) I might feel differently...
     
    >
    > generally speaking, I'm all in favor of perversion, but I
    > think that particular one is a little ambitious for me.
    > think I'm going to do a wee bit more homework and see about
    > VPART.[/ref]

    After I wrote the above I realized it was pretty stupid. Make that
    primary an ext2 partition & it's guaranteed to be invisible to all
    Dos-ish OSs.


    --
    == == almost usable email address: DragText AT E-vertise.Com == ==
    __________________________________________________ _________________

    | DragText v3.8
    Rich Walsh | A Distinctly Different Desktop Enhancement
    Ft Myers, FL | http://e-vertise.com/dragtext/
    __________________________________________________ _________________

    Rich Guest

  19. #19

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 04:08:36 UTC, "Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz"
    <lspace.org.invalid> wrote: 
    >
    > Why would you want either / or /boot to be a primary partition instead
    > of a logical drive? The only reaons that I can think of for a primary
    > partition are:
    >
    > 1. You want to boot directly to it.
    > 2. It has a system that won't work on a logical.[/ref]

    I wasn't suggesting that / or /boot be placed in a primary - and certainly
    not one that's 7MB. I was suggesting that GRUB - and only GRUB - be placed
    there. Given that Boot Manager won't boot a logical partition on Drive 1
    but will boot a primary, and that the space is there and otherwise unused,
    it seems like a good matchup. Plus, it avoids the need to introduce another
    unknown into the equation: a new and unfamiliar (to the O.P.) boot manager.
    While replacing Boot Manager with something more competent may ultimately
    be the way to go, I tend to favor phased implementations.


    --
    == == almost usable email address: DragText AT E-vertise.Com == ==
    __________________________________________________ _________________

    | DragText v3.8
    Rich Walsh | A Distinctly Different Desktop Enhancement
    Ft Myers, FL | http://e-vertise.com/dragtext/
    __________________________________________________ _________________

    Rich Guest

  20. #20

    Default Re: SuSE under Boot Manager?, part II

    On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 03:13:48 UTC in comp.os.os2.setup.misc, "Shmuel
    (Seymour J.) Metz" <lspace.org.invalid> wrote:
     

    Not true, it can handle as many as you have partitions that are
    accessible via INT 13[X]. If your BIOS doesn't have INT13X then it's
    limited to the number of partitions you can fit in the first 1024
    cylinders of each disk, if it does have INT13X then it doesn't care
    about cylinder numbers any more.

    I seem to remember that I had a scrollable Boot Manager menu at one
    point.

    --
    Trevor Hemsley, Brighton, UK.
    pipex.com
    Trevor Guest

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