Text on face of a cylinder

[John_Crisp@adobeforums.com]

Hi,

I am using AI 10 and wanted to add text to the face of a cylinder (actually a ring) that is tilted forwards in the vertical plane.

I tried using warp/arc but that just bends the text up at the ends, and does not give a '3D' effect. I need it to look like the text wraps around the ring.

I have posted a copy of the design here - I had to reproduce it from a scan and ended up physically tracing the lettering as I couldn't figure this out :

<http://yuan.demon.co.uk/mybay/NAHT.jpg>
<http://yuan.demon.co.uk/mybay/NAHT.ai>

Any help gratefully received.

B. Rgds
John

[BobHill@adobeforums.com]

John,

Unless you are using a true 3D CAD program, that's the only way I know of making the text go round the bend and especially if you wished the backside of the text to appear as it and after the "bend". You can use Envelope warp for fitting text to the side of the container, but only to the "bend" would that work.

Bob

[James_Talmage@adobeforums.com]

"Unless you are using a true 3D CAD program, that's the only way I know of making the text go round the bend and especially if you wished the backside of the text to appear as it and after the "bend"..."

John,

As I recall, AI10 has the Object:EnvelopeDistort:MakeWithMesh command, right?

Try this:

1) Set the text. Draw a rectangle around it as wide and as you want the ellipse to be, and as tall as you want the "ribbon" to be. Center the two objects relative to each other and Group.

2) Object: Envelope Distort: Make With Mesh. Set options to 1 Row, 2 Columns.

3) DirectSelect both of the two center points of the envelope and drag them straight downward a bit. Do not mess with their handles.

4) DirectSelect the lower left corner point of the envelope. Both of its handles are extended; one up, the other to the right. Select the handle which is extended right, toward the center of the graphic, and drag it to a position directly below the corner point. (Having Smart Guides on while doing this will make it easy.)

5) Do the same for the right bottom corner point. The bottom of the envelope should be like a half-ellipse now.

6) Do the same for the top left corner point and the top right corner point. (Although it's not difficult to get a convincing elliptical shape "freehand", you can see that it would be a simple matter to set up a few guides to help make things symmetrical. Or, if you know how to use SmartGuides, you can make it nicely symmetrical without needing any temporary construction.

Believe it or not, it is also not difficult to use this method to "wrap" the text around the "back side" of the ellipse.

Just FYI, you can do it two additional ways in AI CS: With a PathText object set to Skew orientation, or by making a Symbol of the text and then mapping it to the surface a circle extruded with the 3D Effect (set the circle to white fill, no shading to just show the text).

If you happen to have InDesign, you can do the Skew orientation to Path Text there; then copy/paste it to AI.

See this for an example of orbiting text made with the Skew/PathText method (done in FH, but it's the same thing):

<http://www.IllustrationETC.com/FHBuds/FHOrbitText/OrbitText.html>

See this for an example of text mapped to a 3D object uisng AICS's 3D Effect (donuts here, but same principle for a cylinder):

<http://www.IllustrationETC.com/AIBuds/LeapFrogDoughnuts/LeapFrogDoughnuts.html>

The caveat about using Text Path is that each character is merely skewed, and therefore has straight hoizontal strokes and edges, which would be undesirably noticable using an extended typeface as in your example. So after building it, you would still need to convert to paths and tweak a curve into the horizontals. Still, less work than tracing the whole thing.

JET

[James_Talmage@adobeforums.com]

"Unless you are using a true 3D CAD program, that's the only way I know of making the text go round the bend and especially if you wished the backside of the text to appear as it and after the "bend"..."

John,

As I recall, AI10 has the Object:EnvelopeDistort:MakeWithMesh command, right?

Try this:

1) Set the text. Draw a rectangle around it as wide as you want the ellipse to be, and as tall as you want the "ribbon" to be. Center the two objects relative to each other and Group.

2) Object: Envelope Distort: Make With Mesh. Set options to 1 Row, 2 Columns.

3) DirectSelect both of the two center points of the envelope and drag them straight downward a bit. Do not mess with their handles.

4) DirectSelect the lower left corner point of the envelope. Both of its handles are extended; one up, the other to the right. Select the handle which is extended right, toward the center of the graphic, and drag it to a position directly below the corner point. (Having Smart Guides on while doing this will make it easy.)

5) Do the same for the right bottom corner point. The bottom of the envelope should be like a half-ellipse now.

6) Do the same for the top left corner point and the top right corner point. (Although it's not difficult to get a convincing elliptical shape "freehand", you can see that it would be a simple matter to set up a few guides to help make things symmetrical. Or, if you know how to use SmartGuides, you can make it nicely symmetrical without needing any temporary construction.

Believe it or not, it is also not difficult to use this method to "wrap" the text around the "back side" of the ellipse.

Just FYI, you can do it two additional ways in AI CS: With a PathText object set to Skew orientation, or by making a Symbol of the text and then mapping it to the surface a circle extruded with the 3D Effect (set the circle to white fill, no shading to just show the text).

If you happen to have InDesign, you can do the Skew orientation to Path Text there; then copy/paste it to AI.

See this for an example of orbiting text made with the Skew/PathText method (done in FH, but it's the same thing):

<http://www.IllustrationETC.com/FHBuds/FHOrbitText/OrbitText.html>

See this for an example of text mapped to a 3D object uisng AICS's 3D Effect (donuts here, but same principle for a cylinder):

<http://www.IllustrationETC.com/AIBuds/LeapFrogDoughnuts/LeapFrogDoughnuts.html>

The caveat about using Text Path is that each character is merely skewed, and therefore has straight hoizontal strokes and edges, which would be undesirably noticable using an extended typeface as in your example. So after building it, you would still need to convert to paths and tweak a curve into the horizontals. Still, less work than tracing the whole thing.

JET

[B. Philippus]

John:

Heres an example of artwork wrapping around a cylinder (the bottle is a photograph, the art is superimposed on it) which may be helpful to you, and an Illustrator file that describes the basics of wrapping around cylinders.

Bottle <http://www.itchybug.com/4-oz-bottle-small.gif>

3-d Cylinder <http://www.itchybug.com/cylinderwrap.ai>

The preset envelopes in Illustrator are not all that useful, but working with the custom "top object" works great.

Bert

[Harron_K._Appleman@adobeforums.com]

Terrific stuff, Bert.

=-= Harron =-=

[BobHill@adobeforums.com]

Perhaps a clarification of "around the bend": That would be where the text continues past the visual curve of a solid cylinder, but without the cylinder the text would still follow a complete circle (true 3D) and the text would be visible at the bend as an edge and continue until the text is reversed. You can't do that in an envelope or distort in any version of Illustrator without manual manipulation and it certainly wouldn't rotate like the bottle. Bert. That was great, bye the way. The way I saw the original artwork problem would have to be done manually. <http://yuan.demon.co.uk/mybay/NAHT.jpg>

Bob

[James_Talmage@adobeforums.com]

"...You can't do that in an envelope or distort in any version of Illustrator..."

<http://www.IllustrationETC.com/AIBuds/AIEnvelopeText.pdf>

JET

[ID._Awe@adobeforums.com]

James: Brilliant! THH.

[Kurt_Gold@adobeforums.com]

As it seems Envelopes are still underestimated…:-)

Kurt Gold

[BobHill@adobeforums.com]

James,

I truly stand corrected (not the first time) for that to be done other than manually is fantastic and now how about detailing the steps you used. Is this included in the new WOW book, do you know?

Bob

[James_E._Talmage@adobeforums.com]

"Is this included in the new WOW book, do you know?"

I don't know. Haven't read that book.

"...and now how about detailing the steps you used..."

That would pretty much be the steps in my first post in this thread. To make it wrap "around the bend", I just moved the points at the left and right sides of the Envelope upward and toward the center in the PDF, and then made their horizontal handles extend outward instead of inward. (This would have been more evident in the PDF if I had used screenshots so the handles would be visible, but I assmembled it in a hurry. Still, though, each step is shown, and you should be able to discern the directions of the handles from the shape of the rectangle I included to indicate the shape of the Envelope.)

The basic idea of making an envelope bend back upon itself is also shown in this PDF from a previous discussion:

<http://www.illustrationETC.com/AIBuds/AIGoofyGrids.pdf>

(2 Pages. May load slow, so give it time.)

Again, turning on Smart Guides and/or SnapGrid makes aligning the points and handles fairly painless where symmetry is desired.

As I think Bert was aluding to in his comment about the preset Envelopes being "not all that useful", I often find the way to get good use from Envelopes (and meshes) is to just make them as simple as possible. An Envelope made using Make From Mesh, but with only 1 row and 1 column, is one of the most useful.

JET

[John_Crisp@adobeforums.com]

Dear all,

Blimey, what an education !

Many thanks for all the kind replies and hard work involved. I have tried both main methods described here, and they work well.

As a real beginner at Illustrator, this has made me think about how else these techniques can be applied to things that I have already been working on.

Thanks once again. I really appreciate the time and effort.

Best regards,

John

[BobHill@adobeforums.com]

Jet,

I particularly like your bike image. Trials is THE greatest motorcycle sport in my personal favorite. Now I've got work myself to do to catch up on this one. Some great examples, James. Great stuff.

Bob

[James_E._Talmage@adobeforums.com]

"Trials is THE greatest motorcycle sport..."

A man after my own heart. I just got back from scoring an STRA event in TN yesterday. Despite the sunburn, it was worth it. Suffice it to say Ray Peters is amazing!

JET

[BobHill@adobeforums.com]

Trials is certainly a lot better for spectator watching (and certainly not bad for skill either). It's the difference between slalom and downhill in skiing in my estimation. But in any event, I haven't done much in that avenue since the mid 70's.

But your course design image is great, in any case.

Bob

[Cathie_Howell@adobeforums.com]

OK, I'm not the best at creating 3-D objects....... How did you create the shapes in the Al envelope text pdf? I can do the basic ones but how do you make the shape bend backwards like it's bending around a circle? Like in 4-6 and the first two on the bottom left..... NEVERMIND I just did it! WOOHOO!
Hey, thanks for all your tips! Much appreciated.