transparency and digital printing problem

[simon_biddell@adobeforums.com]

Hello

I recently did a flyer which was printed digitally and noticed a couple of instances where the bounding box of an image with transparency had effected the colour background underneath.

The flyer was printed from pdf, transparency flattener was set to high. The images were tiff with clipping paths. They were stock photos but I applied a path cos they hadn't been cut ou too well.

There was no indication of a problem either on screen or in the pdf.

My guess is that:

a)it’s a drawback of digital printing (cos the same thing happens on bog standard Lasers, which is ok cos I know that it won’t happen from film/plates)

or

b)I should have put the image on a new, top layer in CS

or

c) I might have converted them to cmyk by mistake (tho would this cause the above?)

or

d)????

Any one else come across this or can explain?!

[mikewitherell_at_jetsetcom_dot_net]

Basics first: Always try to harmonize color models. If RGB digital printer, make the graphics in RGB color model. Make the Swatches in RGB. Make the Edit > Transparency Flattener set to RGB document. When in the Print dialog box, make sure you are sending RGB to the printer. I mention RGB, because most digital printers are designed to handle RGB color mode, despite the fact that you may see C, M, Y, and K cartridges within the digital proofer/printer.

And yes, it doesn't hurt to put objects with transparency on their own layer in the document, apart from type layers.

Mike Witherell in Washington DC

[mikewitherell_at_jetsetcom_dot_net]

Oops,

Where is used the expression Edit > Transparency Flattener

I meant to say:

Edit > Transparency Blend Space

Pardon,

Mike Witherell in Washington DC

[Sofia_Panayotova@adobeforums.com]

simon, i'm having the exact same problem - the file looks ok on pdf, prints ok through PS drivers (on 2 different printers), but when we took it to digital printing the background changed around not only the images, but also the texts that had shadows. I checked the color correction - it was not turned on.

And the background changes around the objects when we print through a regular (as in, not ps) driver on a b&w printer at the office, even if we print straight from ID rather than a PDF... obviously the problem lies in the way ID interprets and prints colors.

I am waiting for feedback from a very experienced person, hope she should be able to suggest smth, but did you manage to find a solution in the meantime?

[Karen_C@adobeforums.com]

This is what I do(I print to a Xerox Digital Docucentre both direct from ID and from Acrobat).

Always put a blank layer between text and the layers underneath, including transparency. I do it automatically at the beginning of a job now - I label a layer text1, text 2 etc and put a blank locked layer in between them and all the images and transparencies. If it's transparent text I still put a blank between it and the next layer above.

[Sofia_Panayotova@adobeforums.com]

Karen, if i got it right you do smth like this:

Text layer
Blank layer
Text later w/ transparencies
Blank layer
Layer with images + transparencies

Is that so?

And have you had similar problems prior to employing the blank layer technique?

[mikewitherell_at_jetsetcom_dot_net]

Blank layers is a good idea that works for many and has been recommended often in this forum.

Another variable relating to color is color management in both the InDesign software, and color management in the printer driver software. Generally, you want to do it one way or the other, but not both.

In many printer drivers, it can be really hard to discern among its many clickable choices what is interfering with the color interpretation. Many printer drivers are labeled with strange language making it harder to know whether the printer driver is adding some "secret sauce" to the color rendering.

I suggest you read closely exactly what the printer driver is doing.

Mike Witherell in Washington DC

[simon_biddell@adobeforums.com]

A colleague who attended the Adobe London Roadshow recently told me that the problem can be avoided by saving images with clipping paths as eps. So does this rule out using any other file format in CS if you want to eliminate a background?

[Bob_Levine]

Why anyone would use a clipping path at this point is beyond me. Just
delete the background and save as PSD.

Bob

[mikewitherell_at_jetsetcom_dot_net]

The only thing I can think of here is that this old-style approach flies underneath any transparency flattening, and thus would not affect color or text.

Mike Witherell

[Sofia_Panayotova@adobeforums.com]

ufh...
problem is far more serious than expected...

tried 1. removing color correction on printers
2. inserting blank layers
3. insertings psd files with shadows in them
4. saving with various ps and pdf settings

and nothing worked. unfortunately, all 4 of us in the firm are running out of ideas, and the situation is getting pretty ugly. i guess we could work some way around using shadows from the ID option, but that's not the question, is it? :-/

[Karen_C@adobeforums.com]

In reply to "Sofia's" post ...

yes, that's what I do with layers.

And yes, I used to have trouble until I did this.

[Sofia_Panayotova@adobeforums.com]

karen, i probably didn't make it clear... i did it with layers and still it didn't work...

[Ken_Garove@adobeforums.com]

I had the same problem. Bounding boxes were filled in a different background shade on graphis with transparency when printing to my Canon inkjet. I tried adding a locked, blank layer in between text and graphics with transparency with no luck.
I also made sure all graphics (created in photoshop)were set to rgb and the transparency blend was set to rgb.

Answer: Create a transparent box in rgb mode(in Photoshop)the same size as your background color and place it on a layer above the background color layer--so it covers the entire background.
The bounding boxes disappear on the printed output!

rg

[simon_biddell@adobeforums.com]

Answer: Create a transparent box in rgb mode(in Photoshop)the same size as your background color and place it on a layer above the background color layer--so it covers the entire background.
The bounding boxes disappear on the printed output!

Thanks, Ken, this seems to work a treat to a most annoying problem! Excellent fix and thanks for sharing!

[Jude_Phillips@adobeforums.com]

Has InDesign CS fixed this problem? I have the upgrade coming and I certainly hope it has. I use a Ricoh Aficio 3850C with a Fiery Rip and I assumed it was the printer's fault (it also won't recognize "paper" as white, instead I get grey). But when projects have gone to the Printer (not my printer) they are having the same problem and it's always with rotated items with a drop shadow. This is an annoying problem!!