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Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row - Photography

Wonder if anyone knows of any resource that might confirm what I'm hearing.....pre-accelerator readers will fry the current r/w accelerated cards, such as the SanDisk Ultra II 80X CF card? I failed 2 new cards in the past couple of weeks. The failure appears to be physical and not logical....recovery software does not recognize the card, as well as other devices, such as cameras, card readers, etc. Is anyone aware of any info on reliable web sites (manufacturers, forums) that might confirm that the "old" readers will fry the new 80X cards? Thanks, and Cheers, Jim...

  1. #1

    Default Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Wonder if anyone knows of any resource that might confirm what I'm
    hearing.....pre-accelerator readers will fry the current r/w accelerated
    cards, such as the SanDisk Ultra II 80X CF card?

    I failed 2 new cards in the past couple of weeks. The failure appears to be
    physical and not logical....recovery software does not recognize the card,
    as well as other devices, such as cameras, card readers, etc.

    Is anyone aware of any info on reliable web sites (manufacturers, forums)
    that might confirm that the "old" readers will fry the new 80X cards?

    Thanks, and Cheers,
    Jim


    Jim Guest

  2. #2

    Default Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    SanDisk Ultra II are rated at 60x (not 80x) ~9MB/s and Extreme III are rated at 133x
    ~20MB/s.

    What are "pre-accelerator readers" ?
    I use the SanDisk USB 2.0 6 -in- 1 and don't have any problems with any Ultra II CF cards.

    I do know that Type I CF readers will not work with the above CF cards.

    --
    Dave




    "Jim Larkey" <net> wrote in message
    news:supernews.com...
    | Wonder if anyone knows of any resource that might confirm what I'm
    | hearing.....pre-accelerator readers will fry the current r/w accelerated
    | cards, such as the SanDisk Ultra II 80X CF card?
    |
    | I failed 2 new cards in the past couple of weeks. The failure appears to be
    | physical and not logical....recovery software does not recognize the card,
    | as well as other devices, such as cameras, card readers, etc.
    |
    | Is anyone aware of any info on reliable web sites (manufacturers, forums)
    | that might confirm that the "old" readers will fry the new 80X cards?
    |
    | Thanks, and Cheers,
    | Jim
    |
    |


    David Guest

  3. #3

    Default Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    I just ordered a Sandisk Ultra II 512 card. I assume it will work fine in
    the camera, but are you telling me my reader may not read it? Actually, my
    supplier doesn't even carry the "regular" Sandisk cards anymore.

    Any other problems with the Ultra II card?

    Sheldon


    "David H. Lipman" <DLipman~nospam~Verizon.Net> wrote in message
    news:ylxQd.21641$.. 


    Sheldon Guest

  4. #4

    Default Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Sheldon wrote: [/ref][/ref]

    I have two much-read 512 Ultra IIs and a twice-read Extreme 2GB, and
    have run 512 and 1GB Lexar 40x and 80x cards, all through the same
    reader, no ill effects of that nature on any of the cards.

    The reader came installed on a computer I bought 14 months ago, and was
    probably state-of-the-art minus two or three at that point. Is that old
    enough?

    What was the source of 'what you're hearing'?


    --
    Frank ess
    "There are some aspects of existence that simply do not yield to
    thinking, plain or fancy."


    Frank Guest

  5. #5

    Default Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Sheldon:

    No you should have no problems I have several Ultra II and they work great.

    Just make sure your CF Reader reads both Type I and Type II CF cards.

    --
    Dave




    "Sheldon" <net> wrote in message
    news:com...
    | I just ordered a Sandisk Ultra II 512 card. I assume it will work fine in
    | the camera, but are you telling me my reader may not read it? Actually, my
    | supplier doesn't even carry the "regular" Sandisk cards anymore.
    |
    | Any other problems with the Ultra II card?
    |
    | Sheldon
    |
    |
    | "David H. Lipman" <DLipman~nospam~Verizon.Net> wrote in message
    | news:ylxQd.21641$..
    | > SanDisk Ultra II are rated at 60x (not 80x) ~9MB/s and Extreme III are
    | > rated at 133x
    | > ~20MB/s.
    | >
    | > What are "pre-accelerator readers" ?
    | > I use the SanDisk USB 2.0 6 -in- 1 and don't have any problems with any
    | > Ultra II CF cards.
    | >
    | > I do know that Type I CF readers will not work with the above CF cards.
    | >
    | > --
    | > Dave
    | >
    | >
    | >
    | >
    | > "Jim Larkey" <net> wrote in message
    | > news:supernews.com...
    | > | Wonder if anyone knows of any resource that might confirm what I'm
    | > | hearing.....pre-accelerator readers will fry the current r/w accelerated
    | > | cards, such as the SanDisk Ultra II 80X CF card?
    | > |
    | > | I failed 2 new cards in the past couple of weeks. The failure appears
    | > to be
    | > | physical and not logical....recovery software does not recognize the
    | > card,
    | > | as well as other devices, such as cameras, card readers, etc.
    | > |
    | > | Is anyone aware of any info on reliable web sites (manufacturers,
    | > forums)
    | > | that might confirm that the "old" readers will fry the new 80X cards?
    | > |
    | > | Thanks, and Cheers,
    | > | Jim
    | > |
    | > |
    | >
    | >
    |
    |


    David Guest

  6. #6

    Default Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    > What was the source of 'what you're hearing'? 

    See the next post!


    Sheldon Guest

  7. #7

    Default Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Sheldon wrote: 
    >
    > See the next post![/ref]

    Sorry. Once read they're gone.


    --
    Frank ess


    Frank Guest

  8. #8

    Default Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    "Jim Larkey" <net> writes:
     

    I have an old CF reader that I put an accelerated card in -- just wouldn't
    recognize it. Used my wife's reader, and it read the card fine, so I got a
    more recent reader for my Mac, and the card still is working fine (this was
    a Christmas present, and we spent 2 weeks on vacation in the French West
    Indies, and used the card every day in the camera and downloading to
    computer.
     

    I don't fail my cards. :->
     

    I assume you've tried formatting the card in camera, and it won't do it? I
    always format the cards in the camera, not in the computer (I don't even
    erase the card in the computer).
     

    My old reader did not fry the card, just wouldn't see it.

    --
    Phil Stripling | email to the replyto address is presumed
    The Civilized Explorer | spam and read later. email from this URL
    http://www.cieux.com/ | http://www.civex.com/ is read daily.
    Phil Guest

  9. #9

    Default SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Thanks for all your comments. I'll try to answer below.....

    I've talked with tech support at SanDisk and Zio. Both offered my "old" USB
    Microtech Cameramate type 1&2 reader as incompatible with the Ultra II
    accelerated cards.

    The incompatiblity goes beyond just not being able to read. Sandisk
    indicated that the CF card is physically (fried) damaged, and not logical.
    There my photos are totally lost....not recoverable with recovery software,
    which by the way I tried.

    Both cards are not recognized by my 20D and 1G. They error out. No
    opportunity to reformat. On the PC, the bootup stalls for 15 minutes while
    trying to recognize the card read, than device is not available.

    I continue to use the card reader on my Microdrive, old Sandisk, Kingston,
    and Viking CF cards.

    So what I've heard from Sandisk, is that if you have an old reader that
    predates the accelerated card era, using it on an accelerated card puts your
    photos at risk...like no recovery.

    So, are these just flakey tech support (Sandisk, Zio) reps, or is this real?

    Cheers,
    Jim


    Jim Guest

  10. #10

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 06:50:38 -0500, "Jim Larkey"
    <net> wrote:
     

    I don't know, I think I'd just scrape up the $40 or so and buy a new
    reader.


    Drifter
    "I've been here, I've been there..."
    Drifter Guest

  11. #11

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Ditto !

    --
    Dave




    "Drifter" <com> wrote in message
    news:com...
    |
    | I don't know, I think I'd just scrape up the $40 or so and buy a new
    | reader.
    |
    |
    | Drifter
    | "I've been here, I've been there..."


    David Guest

  12. #12

    Default Lost Photos....Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    The photos that were lost, and potential photos could be lost (vacation,
    family occassions) are priceless.

    I've remedied the 2 failed cards, and the reader issue. The reason I'm
    posting is to advise others that the tech support rep's of a reputable CF
    card mfgr. are saying that the loss of photos could happen to others with
    old readers.

    I'm already down the road with the solution, just looking for verification
    of tech support opinion.

    Thanks for your comments,
    Jim


    Jim Guest

  13. #13

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    > So what I've heard from Sandisk, is that if you have an old reader that 

    The problem I see with this "conclusion" (from Sandisk) is that it leaves
    open the likelihood that a (or many) particular cameras themselves might
    interface in a similar way as an older reader, thus damaging the card. Yet
    nobody's claiming that might happen?

    --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
    www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


    "Jim Larkey" <net> wrote in message
    news:supernews.com... 


    Mike Guest

  14. #14

    Default Re: Lost Photos....Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Capice !

    --
    Dave




    "Jim Larkey" <net> wrote in message
    news:supernews.com...
    | The photos that were lost, and potential photos could be lost (vacation,
    | family occassions) are priceless.
    |
    | I've remedied the 2 failed cards, and the reader issue. The reason I'm
    | posting is to advise others that the tech support rep's of a reputable CF
    | card mfgr. are saying that the loss of photos could happen to others with
    | old readers.
    |
    | I'm already down the road with the solution, just looking for verification
    | of tech support opinion.
    |
    | Thanks for your comments,
    | Jim
    |
    |


    David Guest

  15. #15

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    That's a good point Mike, I wish I would have thought of that when talking
    with the Sandisk rep.

    This really get bazaar.....they said that using my IBM Microdrive on
    Sandisk's new CF readers will "fry the reader" (excessive current drain) and
    using the Ultra IIs on my Microtech reader will "fry the cards". Looks like
    I'll have to install 2 readers, one for MD and other for CFs.

    Cheers,
    Jim

    "Mike Jacoubowsky" <netcom.com> wrote in message
    news:rPKQd.567$news.prodigy.com... 
    >
    > The problem I see with this "conclusion" (from Sandisk) is that it leaves
    > open the likelihood that a (or many) particular cameras themselves might
    > interface in a similar way as an older reader, thus damaging the card. Yet
    > nobody's claiming that might happen?
    >
    > --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
    > www.ChainReactionBicycles.com[/ref]


    Jim Guest

  16. #16

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    "Jim Larkey" <net> writes:
     

    I believe that's true.
     

    With regard to type I and type II, see
    http://www.compactflash.org/faqs/faq.htm#What_is

    A google of the difference between I and II is that the _only_ difference
    is the thickness.

    As to Write Accelerated cards,
    http://www.dphoto.us/news/node/view/347
    gives a press release of the new Extreme III cards, then the fastest in
    the world. There is no mention of lack of backward compatibility with older
    hardware.

    Rob Galbraith's site at
    http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=6007
    mentions only that the speed is a function of faster flash memory. He
    mentions no lack of backwards compatibility with old hardware.

    I would urge you to post your experience in his forum at
    http://www.robgalbraith.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php
    to see what the consensus is there.
     

    I'm sorry to hear that. I'd keep the cards while parsing out what the error
    is. I assume they have the lifetime warranty? I'd put Sandisk on notice of
    the claim, letting them know you're holding onto the cards while finding
    out if you got good answers to your questions.
     

    Just to confirm, I have a Lexar 1GB WA 80x card, which I put into a USB
    card reader (make and model uknown, as I replaced it and tossed it) which
    would not read the card. It never showed up on my desk top. Putting that
    card in my wife's Lexar FireWire reader mounted it on the computer, and all
    was fine. I have since gotten a new reader, and the CF card has worked fine
    since I got it for Christmas.

    If Sandisks are different from Lexars, I'll be very surprised. If that's
    the case, something needs to be said about it on Galbraith's site.

    --
    Phil Stripling | email to the replyto address is presumed
    The Civilized Explorer | spam and read later. email from this URL
    http://www.cieux.com/ | http://www.civex.com/ is read daily.
    Phil Guest

  17. #17

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Thanks Phil for the wealth of information, and sharing your experience.
    Sounds like there might be some truth in what the Sandisk rep said.

    I tried yesterday to register, and emailed Mike Sturk-robgalbraith.com
    forums moderator, regarding problems with accepting my password/verify
    password. I just cannot get their site to accept my password(s)....tried
    alot of them. Mike gave up, and so did I.

    I agree that something should be posted on robgalbraith.com

    Seems that the mfgrs ought to be a little more up front about the nature on
    incompatibility, if indeed pre-accelerator readers are incompatible with the
    new accelerator cards. The nature of incompatibility, as I found goes
    beyond just not recognizing the device. I lost about 2 dozen photos, none
    of which were really very valuable.

    My concern is for the loss of vacation pics, either mine or other users.
    Sure can fit a lot of pics on one of those 1GB cards. I've got a new reader
    coming, but it seems that this issue is still lurking out there.

    Thanks again Phil for your useful post. I will spend some time digesting
    your suggested resources.

    Cheers,
    Jim


    Jim Guest

  18. #18

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    I just tried a Sandisk II CF card in a Kodak PCMCIA reader in my notebook.
    This think can't be the latest reader as I only paid $10 for it new. Reads
    the card just fine. No warnings of any kind on the Sandisk packaging.


    "Mike Jacoubowsky" <netcom.com> wrote in message
    news:rPKQd.567$news.prodigy.com... 
    >
    > The problem I see with this "conclusion" (from Sandisk) is that it leaves
    > open the likelihood that a (or many) particular cameras themselves might
    > interface in a similar way as an older reader, thus damaging the card. Yet
    > nobody's claiming that might happen?
    >
    > --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
    > www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
    >
    >
    > "Jim Larkey" <net> wrote in message
    > news:supernews.com... 
    >
    >[/ref]


    Sheldon Guest

  19. #19

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    Jim Larkey wrote:
     
    nature on 
    with the 

    You can't stamp "CF" on the product without it conforming to the
    published interface.

    http://www.compactflash.org/

    My initial assessment of your claims:

    1. the "mfgrs" test their hardware for backwards compatibility (for
    _very_ good reasons), and the hardware passes these tests before being
    put into a box for sale.

    2. your card reader is probably (if not certainly) defective.
     
    goes 
    none 

    What? But in another posting you say that
     

    Emphasis added. So "were" the images you lost priceless or "were" they
    not?
     
    users. 
    reader 

    You have one "coming"? I could have a new reader in my hand within 20
    minutes, and many people reading this are in a similar situation. Do
    you live on the Moon perhaps?
     
    digesting 

    But wait: how could you have a new reader "coming" without first
    "digesting" the references? If your claims of incompatibility are
    correct, for all you know the new reader is just as bad as your current
    one.

    Basically, for these reasons and the general tone, you sound like a
    typical FUDster troll. Do you even own a Sandisk CF card? Is your
    single failure (even if it exists), in a field of millions upon
    millions of successes really grounds for demanding the "mfgrs" be more
    "upfront" about alledged "incompatibilities"?

    eawckyegcy@yahoo.com Guest

  20. #20

    Default Re: SanDisk Tech Support Re: Ultra II CF Card Failures, Two in a Row

    In article <tdl.com>,
    Phil Stripling <zzn.com> wrote: 

    [ ... ]
     
    >
    >Just to confirm, I have a Lexar 1GB WA 80x card, which I put into a USB
    >card reader (make and model uknown, as I replaced it and tossed it) which
    >would not read the card. It never showed up on my desk top. Putting that
    >card in my wife's Lexar FireWire reader mounted it on the computer, and all
    >was fine. I have since gotten a new reader, and the CF card has worked fine
    >since I got it for Christmas.[/ref]

    As another data point, I also have the same Lexar cards (1GB,
    WA, 80x), which I use in my Nikon D70. I had been reading it in a
    little five-way reader which connects to a Windows box via USB, but I
    always prefer to work in unix if I can, so I now can. The Sun Sbus
    PCMCIA card adaptor does not work with large sizes -- but -- an
    interesting alternative popped up (found by a friend in a used computer
    which he got). It is a SPYRUS "RD400 Internal Reader", which is a
    floppy sized package which connects to the SCSI bus used by the Suns.
    It occupies two SCSI IDs (one for each socket). I plug the flash cards
    into it using a "SanDisk CompactFlash PC Card Adaptor" (other brands
    work just as well -- this happens to be the one which I had handy when
    testing it came around).

    The main trick turned out to be figuring the proper syntax for
    mounting the flash cards. I put these two lines into my /etc/vfstab
    (the file which controls mounting all kinds of filesystems):

    ================================================== ====================
    /dev/dsk/c1t0d0s0:c - /fc0 pcfs - no rw,foldcase
    /dev/dsk/c1t1d0s0:c - /fc1 pcfs - no rw,foldcase
    ================================================== ====================

    (the "foldcase" means that my filenames all come in lower case, as I
    prefer, not upper case, as is the old MS-DOS practice.)

    The name of the devices to mount "/dev/dsk/c1t0d0s0:c" and
    "/dev/dsk/c1t1d0s0:c" were not doented, and it took a while to figure
    them out.

    However, now, I can read the disks directly in my Sun machine.

    I hope that this may be some help to others who would like to
    read these cards in a Sun. (It also works with the old PCMCIA hard
    disks which my N90s/NC2000e (Nikon/Kodak hybrid) requires.)
     

    I wonder whether I will be able to read the SanDisk flash cards without
    damage. This may be sufficient reason to stick with the Lexar cards.

    Thanks for the warning,
    DoN.
    --
    Email: <com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
    (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
    --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
    DoN. Guest

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